A home for those who love almost everything about The Ticket (1310 AM, 96.7 FM, Dallas-Fort Worth), and who would like to discuss -- respectfully and fondly -- their thoughts on how (and whether) to eliminate the "almost."
Was able to listen to a fair amount of The Downbeat yesterday. Herewith, a few observations.
(1) Mike R is now permitted to be called “Rhyner.” No more of this “Rhyner’s dead” business. I guess there are too many Mikes on the show. It seems to be shaking out that Mike R is “Rhyner” (or “Shoopy” if Michael G is addressing him), Mike S is “Mikey,” and Michael G is ”Grubes” or “Shoopy,” if Rhyner is addressing him. Krystina was on yesterday, and she’s “Krystina.”
(2) Mike has taken to saying “the little Freak” and “the little Downbeat.”
(3) The last couple of times I’ve heard the show, including yesterday, Rhyner has given a little speech along the lines of – “we’re just offering something we hope you like,” sort of a “we’re just an underdog trying something a little different, sure hope you like it” attitude. Far from the bombast of the first few days (although, truth to tell, most of the bombast I heard came from The Speakeasy and especially Ben & Skin).
(4) There was a segment on dumplings and Mike’s dislike of same. They had Mike read a menu from a dumpling restaurant, Bushi-Bushi.
(5) The Sunset Lounge featured a (somewhat confused) discussion of Daylight Savings Time.
(6) The Sunset Lounge intro is cool hipster prose, but it’s just too long. Now that the novelty has worn off, it just sounds like filler.
(7) So we had three voices yesterday, not counting that nice young Michael Gruber. I have no idea whether the rotating group of third voices – they’re really selling the women on this frequency – is a permanent feature. I’m thinking it is. They then introduced a fourth voice and a fourth Mike, Mike “the Machine” Marshall, who was going to do a Mavericks segment that I did not hear. Before that segment, however, he was in charge of a discussion of Season 1, Episode 9, of “Game of Thrones: House of the Dragon.” Coupla things here:
First, I have a bias against these TV show discussions for two reasons: (1) If I’m not watching the show, they’re an annoying interruption at best, a bunch of insiders talking to a bunch of other insiders but not me, and a punch-out at worst. (2) If I’m watching the show, I’m more than likely recording it for viewing later, so I absolutely gotta punch out there to avoid spoilers. The Ticket does these segments too, I was never sure why Cat didn’t eliminate these; although, come to think of it, I haven’t heard any of these segments lately, but maybe my ears weren’t listening at the right time.
Second, in this particular case, I am watching GOT:HOTD and I had seen that particular show, so I was interested.
Third, and here’s the main thing I want to note: Both Mikey and Krystina are fans of the show and they had seen it and Mikey himself said that he was a particular fan. They could have had that discussion without M”tM”M. The fourth voice here (although Rhyner, who of course has seen none of these shows, wasn’t contributing anything here) was unnecessary and there was lots of talking over one another.
Fourth, M”tM”M has some really nice radio pipes. Remember, he had a weekend show on The Ticket with Justin Montemayor several years ago. He did most of the talking on this segment and while he did know his stuff, the presentation was pretty manic and I had a hard time following what he was saying, especially since Mikey and Krystina (who knew the show, remember) were also chiming in. M”tM”M is a talker, which was okay because they’d invited him on to talk, but he has a very aggressive and speedy broadcasting style that clashed somewhat with the relaxed state of affairs on The Downbeat. (All noted how confusing the names are on “House of the Dragon,” and they’re right, but M”tM”M’s use of those names didn’t help the segment.) I don’t want to overstate how muddled all of this sounded, but I think The Downbeat missed an opportunity to promote itself if full-time Freakers Mikey and Krystina had helmed that particular segment.
* * *
Here’s what The Downbeat reminds me of after a couple of weeks now: It sounds like an old AM radio show from the fifties and sixties that would air in the mornings, where the host and maybe one or two others would sit around drinking coffee (several of these hosts had the “Coffeehead” nickname in various markets), sometimes a couple of women, sometimes a man or two (Don McNeill’s Breakfast Club), or even a couple (Don and Roma in Chicago). They might spin a disk now and then. Interviews; some live performance. But those shows were mostly what I thought of as Easy Listening Talk.
And it’s not bad – I didn’t mind the dumpling and daylight-savings talk – but it’s not only not innovative, it sounds, as I’ve now said a couple of times, almost nostalgic (which, I guess, if you don’t have a nostalgia station on the dial, could be considered innovative). Even the names: “Speakeasy,” “Downbeat,” “Sunset Lounge” with its retro intro – all hearken back to a jazz-inflected social history from the middle decades of the last century. The Downbeat isn’t a broadcast disaster, but it’s either a brilliant contrast to the abrasions of Corby/Bob/Davey (just look how many Confessors have sworn off Corby, or claimed to, or want to), or a very subdued way to try to eat into The Ticket’s listenership.
Eh, I think The DownBeat and The Freak as a whole is one big ball of confusion. Hell, dude, even your careful description of what was going down is confusing and a tad headache inducing. Too much, too too much. But the thing that's most glaring is that all the shows are boring. You can't keep doing what they're doing for any mid to long haul. They pretty much read lists or news/fun fact/tales of the strange items from the internet all day. Whereas shows on The Ticket have a segment or even two on most days that are like that, The Freak is just about nothing but it. Rhyner's voice sounds fine. He doesn't sound like your typical 73 year old. Then again, your typical 73 year old isn't heading up/the lead vocalist in a Petty tribute and talking about fooj's and is still (solely) interested in the same things he was in high school. Again, his voice does sound good. The content's another story. He's no different than he was during his final 6-8 years at The Ticket. Which = mailing it in and letting others carry the load. OK, fine. But it all registers a zilch on the compelling content scale. I'm not going to get into the other various and sundry Mikes nor Krystina nor Julie nor the rest. Rhyner is the reason anyone tunes in and he's the reason any of it came together in the first place. So he's the focal point. The Freak succeeds or flops because of Rhyner. BYW, you must've not listened well the first week +, because Rhyner was right there with the rest of them talking smack. He was/still is talking it via Twitter. All of this is pretty opaque and the pattern is readily discerned. Rhyner's not a complex dude. Nothing wrong with that, at all. From the jump (and you weren't around so you can't know) this whole thing has been a get in the Way Back Machine with Mr Peabody and Sherman situation. Rhyner's trying his damnedest to recreate/relive that time. Problem is this is a new day, times and the environment are much much different, and most importantly, the level of the talent he did assemble all those years ago is on an entirely different plane.
1-why so many guest hosts on the downbeat. We have yet to hear just m&m. 2- bad positioning. “We talk about what we want”. How about what we, the listeners, want? The great philosopher Dan MCDowell said do the show for the p-1s. Do the p-1s really want an unending stream of shows that talk about their shows, with a mix in of made up game shows? 3- AM drive in a top 5 market and they feed us a show of 3 inexperienced chuckleheads, none of which have ever carried, or even co-carried a show. Cavanaugh was one of 4-5 guys on G bag, KT was a producer, Julie a ticker person. Go hire folks like Jagger, Jody dean, or Jasmine Sadry, people who have had ratings success in the past. 4- read that b&s have been through 5 stations in like 10+ years. 1310, live 105, espn, fan, eagle. Tells me they aren’t good enough to be kept around. They fill a roll, but aren’t worth a long term contract. Why do we think this stop will be different? 5- I don’t buy the hang zone rumors for a second. Unless I heart spends either stupid money or stupid contract length, who gives up a job on a Marconi winning station where your the heir apparent to move up, to go to a station they could flip back tomorrow. Google d&m contract and says they inked long term deal in 2019. I don’t know what long term means, but say 5 years. If you’re I heart do you sign hang zone to long term deal before station has established itself?
No need to apologize, Plainsman. It wasn't your prose, it was the fact that you accurately described the situation and that even the description is confusing. THAT'S how incoherent TDB (and all the shows) is.
I would think it is in thin ice. The market manager and station PD get fired right before launch. You have a morning show that is a collection of random parts going up against Marconi winning competitors. The midday show is on their 5th station, and they’ve never done really well at any of them. And your drive home is led by a cranky old dude who’s already retired once. Not exactly a recipe for success. And everyone I talk to asks the same question. What are they? They’re not sports. They’re not tradition talk -ie either news or politics- . They may be blazing new ground, but are there listeners there?
Comments to this site have plummeted. This is not an authoritative metric, but it sure seems like P1 ears listened, but have gradually dribbled back to The Little One. Not much more to say about The Freak.
There's nothing wrong with an Easy Talk format, but it's just not going to attract the Hang Zone/Hard Line audience.
We may well see a peak in KEGL numbers for the current quarter as Freak-curious people tuned in based on the "I'm Back, Bitches/We Say What We Want" hype, but I have a hard time seeing that sustained for such a mild product.
He's back; but what is he back from? As the days go by, it's sounding more and more like he's back from Checkout Mike.
Ticket note: I'm a little surprised they're doing Cowboys Theater 1310 again. I was surprised they were able to do it at all, because I thought they would probably run into trouble with The Niffle over their "descriptions and accounts" of a live game. When this popular bit disappeared several years ago, I thought that some legal reason like that may have been the cause of its demise.
But: It's back, bitches, so either they squared things with The Niffle or . . . I was wrong.
Go check out The Freak reddit page. Pretty barren. Mostly threads overtly ginned up by Freak employees populated with 0-4 comments. Peppered throughout, too, are thin-skinned pop ins by Cavanaugh, KT, and Sirois. Freak freak out (pro and con) on The Ticket reddit site has also dwindled down to a trickle.
10/23, 9:29 am makes a very good point. Surely the format change was signed off on long before the PD left. At the very least it was given the OK at some time prior to his departure. That the PD left/was let go (don't know which) right before The Freak went live and that The Freak doesn't yet have a permanent PD speaks volumes about iHeart's committment to The Freak. I have to believe it's on a very short leash and barring something akin to the magic of The Ticket's nascent days, I also have to believe there's a very good chance The Freak no longer exists before the end of May '23. It could come as soon as Jan. 2 '23. Plainsman, I think, is correct in saying their best book will be their first, that that will be the high point, everything going downhill from there. As it stands, the station is such a mess, it's message so mixed, it's very structure (hosts, etc.) so confusing, that it might already be beyond rescue. That the only hope of saving the format is to either come out and officially state they are indeed a sports station, but one of a different sort (sports with an emphasis on lifestyle/entertainment), stop show mixing and establish regularity and continuity and therefore allow host pairings to gel and set their own unique tone, and in conjunction, have TSE and B&S swap timeslots. Even with these changes, it might already be too late.
Plainsman, do you have a MTC email address? I have a theory but I'm not terribly comfortable with publishing it. Yet I would like to know what you think. Perhaps you'll find it OK to publish. Nothing untold or anything like that. But it is a conjecture based on years of observing certain personalities in the parties involved in the Ticket/Freak "issue" at hand.
Will The Freak get a bounce from Mavs season? They do talk sports some. But if they're not Mavs-intensive during the broadcast day, will there be any reason to listen to it rather than The Ticket? I dunno.
Doesn't KRLD get a bit of a pop during Cowboys season?
Hardline Proper Rhyner would've have made fun of that until the end of time. He would have been relentless in his tearing that and those associated with into shreds. Oh Mike, good sir, what HAVE we done?
Ed Wallace will soon enough be proven right about Rhyner.
Jeff Caitlin knows real talent. Obversely, he knows what it isn't.
I don't want to be critical about talent levels, per se. Each of the individuals on The Freak has talent, and, I daresay, broadcast talent. Julie, Jeff, Kevin, Ben, Skin, Krystina, and each and every Mike, some more than others, but no one who is awful on radio.
But man, talent isn't enough.
You've got to place it properly.
You've got to team it properly.
You've got to, yes, program it properly.
You've got to lead, guide it properly.
You've got to promote it properly (and truthfully).
You've got to massage/fix/boss it when it doesn't work as it's supposed to.
You've got to hang it on some kind of structure or format that listeners will recognize when they tune in.
You've got to plan for its deployment before you toss it onto the air with a hugely overblown promotional blast it can't possibly live up to.
around town began to see the new billboards that simply feature an illustration of (only) Rhyner, w/ his name beneath him, station logo to the left and "I'm Back!" to the right. This whole endeavor just reinforces the idea, at its center, is about Mike wanting everything to be about Mike. Consider the fact he now is publicly admitting to being sore the Ticket - in his head - had stopped being about him. No Rhyner, no new station - and that's ironically station's singular strongest and weakest link.
The promotion and heavy sosh presence is why I don't think iHeart has just thrown this up until something better comes along. It's making a considerable financial investment in both conventional promotion (billboards, conventional media coverage) and all the peripheral stuff (social media). I think they think they have a unique story to sell here -- all those ex-Ticket renegades and outlaws and risk-takers.
Whether the product matches the narrative -- not so far, but it's early.
And don't downplay the value of those advertising dollars.
meh. the cost internal to iHeart of co-company promotional (they own the billboards) is really minimal. they've done zero other promotion and social doesn't count as it's a zero-cost add on since they have a person who was doing that for them anyway. The media coverage was pretty average (for they type of story it was at the time) and since then has evaporated.
I think they stopped Cowboy Theatre mostly because the hosts didn't want to schlep up to the station on a Sunday. I certainly don't think the Ticket is panicking over the Freak, but I also don't think it's a coincidence that the station brought back Cowboy Theater and all the host cross pollinations at this particular time.
Maybe, 1054, but Freak billboard ads on iHeart signs mean they're foregoing paying customers. That kind of promotion almost certainly is an expense on the local radio budget. Time spent on every Freak promotion means those people aren't working on other iHeart projects. iHeart continues to climb out of bankruptcy, and its main focus is on digital/podcasts. There are no drops in any buckets. I haven't seen any recent reports, but iHeart lost $48.7 million in its first quarter.
Quite aside from the financial commitment, the Freak launch was loud and impressive. iHeart isn't trying to hide this property until it decides on something else. It's banking on it being successful.
we can agree to disagree on the quality of the station's launch. What we do agree on is that iHeart is treating this about as seriously as they do any station launch in these post-bankruptcy times. I also agree with 0119 that the theme'ing of these boards, whatever they cost, are speaking exclusively to a very niche audience.
I’ll try to phrase this nicely. The ticket is a niche station because they do really well, like REALLY well, in a demo that advertisers covet. Their ratings aren’t earth shaking, they’re good, but ticket isn’t a mass appeal station. Few people outside the sports radio biosphere know who Rhyner is. So basing your marketing on “I’m back” when most people will see the name/face and ask “who are you” seems frankly, dumb. Which makes me think this is about ego more than anything. But ok, he’s back. But who does Rhyner appeal to? Sports talk listeners? Disgruntled ticket listeners who think (insert your own issues here- too woke, too much Corby, not enough callers, not enough sports, too many commercials, see ticket reddit for exhaustive never ending litany of complaints) ? So you’re directly appealing to ticket listeners with “local personality driven lifestyle talk”? And Gordon keith has a radio arrest under his belt. Is any one on 97-1 really a renegade or outlaw? Gluten free Julie Dobbs a risk taker? Please, she orders gluten free pizza! So you’re marketing in a way designed to appeal to sports talk fans, using Rhyner, and serving up something completely different. Ask people what they wanted in Dallas radio, and I bet local personality driven lifestyle talk radio wasn’t high on the request list. So yes they’re marketing, with a product that, as mentioned above, is being met with a great big “meh”. And once you’ve gotten a reputation do you know how hard it is to rebrand? People will see the billboards and I’m sure some will sample the station. But how many are going to say “you know I really don’t care about sports teams, give me more game show knock offs and readings of internet lists, because I love renegades outlaws and risk takers doing lifestyle talk, it’s what I live for”.
Admittedly in my car quite a bit over the weekend, but I saw multiple billboards. I even saw the face of Grubes. Can you imagine the mothership dishing out cash to promote anybody not named George, Craig, or Gordon?
How many years have we heard those who muse so gently joke about the inability to get on billboards? Plainsman mentioned ad dollars earlier, and that’s a good observation. This thing has to have significant financial backing, otherwise you can’t pay all these people they’ve added.
But why in earth would you promote a board op? I mean I like Grubes he’s a fun Twitter follow, but is there an adult in the room asking why they’re doing what they’re doing. It seems like there isn’t. They’re promoting this station like it’s an established brand, and it’s not .
Only one answer to the preceding excellent questions:
iHeart believes The Freak is a real alternative to The Ticket, and they are aiming squarely, and almost exclusively, at Ticket listeners in the demo. People who do know who Grubes is (assuming they've been listening for some number of years), and who certainly know who Rhyner is.
But my Jah, what makes them think Ticket listeners, most of whom are pretty hard-core when it comes to loving the Ticket, are going to be attracted to the bland happy talk and force-fed-females the Freak has been timidly offering so far?
It's like, as someone said above, someone thinks the Reddit griping represents massive discontent among the P1. (I know, people gripe here too. But no one who understands the overnegativity of The Sosh would mistake Reddit/MTC griping for a portable listener base.)
As I said: There may be a market for Easy Talk radio, and there may be enough people who like that not-too-challenging format to make The Freak successful. I just don't see them coming from the greater body of Ticket listeners.
MANY years ago, I sent an email to PMAN, describing my listening day. My 10-noon is when I would schedule meetings, it was only Norm then, but I was good with that. I still don't listen a ton during that time, I really like Donovan and Norm, I just have stuff.
And, something thrown out earlier is interesting. A 10-1, or some such, all female show. I think a LOT of V1s would be interested in a sportsy "girl" show in that slot. If you had Julie, Kristina and Emily, you could do a weekly hockey and baseball show, plus whatever else they come up with. I would actually tune in for both those segments, then go back to the little one.
I think we, as P1s, are looking at this from a myopic perspective. I really think the Freak is intended to be an all day Kidd Kraddick show. Granted, they are very dynamic right now, which leads me to believe they aren't sure who to put where. Almost like a pick-up game. We got the court, now what?
Regardless of the outcome, it is good fodder. Haven't seen MTC this busy in a while.
specific to the comment in your 1st paragraph. iHeart historically is a research driven company. it isn't out of reach to wonder if they did some market research in deciding what to flip KEGL to, and saw something that told them KTCK is vulnerable - and if they got Rhyner - they might be able to steal ad dollars.
Totally disagree. They were a research driven company. Now they’re purely a bottom line driven station where every decision is based on how much immediate payoff -or cost - to the p&l statement. And if you think I’m wrong, tell me what kind of shoddy research tells you to market the station as, and I quote- “local personality driven lifestyle talk radio hosted by a beastly collection of renegades, outlaws, and risk takers”. Is someone seriously going to try to sell me on the idea that “beastly” research’s well? That a focus group said we like renegades and outlaws? I’ve got more to say, it involves Rhyner ego, that I may write up and send to the Plainsman.
my only push back is tied to your P+L reference. Talk is the most expensive format, by a mile, to put on. There are a few music formats they could have launched that would have filled a hole in the market, but would have likely lost all the existing clients & dollars (endorsement and otherwise) they enjoyed with KEGL and pursued w/ the main goal - Ticket's money machine. While the entire thing has the air of something thrown together with little thought - research or not - it's chasing the Ticket's 2x revenue stream is the whole point of this venture.
You invoked Kidd Kraddick. I'll go you one better. Ron Chapman. As a native Dallasite, Rhyner followed Chapman from his days as Irving Harrigan to his glory years on KVIL.
Since you invoked Kidd Kraddick, how about Howard Stern. Stern was always an apple in Rhyner's eye and he has said so many times. I doubt however there are many eagles listeners still around that remember him being on the air there. An all-female show from 9-Noon might fill a niche in this market. Is there a female-hosted sportsy show anywhere else in the nation?
Well, Downbeat took calls, yesterday. I only heard part of it, joined in the middle of a very manic call from someone who greatly amused the group, but I think one needed to hear the whole call to get what was funny. (I'm not sure who the group was. Rhyner and Mikey and Grubes, but there was another voice I wasn't sure about. Maybe Ben?) Then someone purporting to be, and apparently was, Greg Williams's sister, who loves Greggo and wanted Rhyner to be nice to him. He said he was nice to him; said he "loved Greggo."
Rhyner famously hated taking calls at The Ticket, and he didn't seem entirely with the program yesterday. They did a 15-second post-mortem after the segment, and there seemed to be some ambivalence about whether it had worked. But they said they'd try again.
From a 2015 article, possibly quite out of date, but:
"A 2015 ranking by website Talkers.com of the top 100 sports talk shows included only one woman, CBS Sports Radio Network's Amy Lawrence at No. 98. She is the only woman in the country with her own national show five nights a week."
The Fabulous Sports Babe was last heard from in 2001.
No doubt Ron Chapman heavily influenced Mike R. But Chapman (and KISS era Kraddick) never ran on a platform of “we say what we want”, it was broad based happy talk that targeted female listeners. The Freak and all associated bluster is Mike R trying to re-create the aura of one of his other radio leaders, Stern. He’s talked before about how big a fan he was of Howard’s show when it first came to DFW. I think he’s always wanted to do a show like that, unfettered by the structure of sports talk. So he sold iHeart on it, brought on friends that won’t challenge him (on the air or behind the scenes) that will feel indebted to him for getting them back on/keeping them on the air, and now we have the Freak starring a washed boomer telling the same 30-40 year old stories to the delighted over laughing of his minions. Congrats Mike, you did recreate the Howard Stern show, except it’s today’s Stern, not the 1980s version you wanted
As someone who posts lots of Chicago adjacent material here, I'm surprised you're not aware of the Ticket's own Sports Leila and her success in Chicago sports radio
After my time in Chicago, and before my time in Dallas.
Dan Bernstein was/is a great sports radio talker. Smart as hell, he'd be great on The Ticket. His sister Bonnie is an accomplished sports broadcaster, journalist, and executive.
I'm just gonna go off on a little bit of a tangent. What upsets me the most about the whole Freak thing, is how it's changed my opinion of Rhyner. I used to think of him, like many P1's or hosts do, as the godfather. Now I just can't think of him that way.
- The attempt at podcasts seemed ok in the way that he could do them as he pleases, but also such a give up, because that still needed to be more often if he wanted anyone to care.
- The Irish exit was kinda cool but a little odd and made him seem like he thought he was Daft Punk revealing his identity or something.
- Then comes back at another station, at his old time slot, directly competing with, what on air came off of as friends. Yes they are coworkers, but a huge plus of the ticket is that they 'hang out.' Super bowls, campounds, GNO, summer bash, etc. They either are, or give the allusion, of being friends.
- To act like the ticket somehow wronged him in anyway similar to how Sirois was wronged. I'm sure Rhyner was honestly being paid too much for how much he was trying at the end, and to act like he's now in it with Sirois. Also, do we know that board ops, or producers are getting paid any better at the freak? I mean If Sirois is simply making more money because he's a host now, he's not really doing any better than Cumulus would. Also makes me think of the comments from Rhyner, I think directed at Sirois, about how he wouldn't even look at him when they shared a hotel room.
- The return video of him showing back up in the chair, once again, shows he's pretty full of himself.
- With Rhyner's recent sports opinions being of "Luka will leave" and "Cooper Rush should be QB1" Makes me think he should avoid sports honestly.
Sorry for the rant with there being actual good discussion going on, I just have been thinking about how my perception of Rhyner has changed a lot through all of this.
I really regret leaving this comment, so you may wonder why I'm leaving it at all.
But I say what I want, and sometimes when I don't want.
I'm a Mike Sirois fan. Loved Cirque, loved him on middays, loved him filling in. Was looking forward to hearing him with Rhyner.
But he does not sound comfortable at all on The Downbeat.
I can't put my finger on it. It's not that he's still ring-kissing. Nothing overt, anyway. But he sounds like he's being really, really careful. Somewhat formal. Speaking very slowly. Like he's not entirely sure what a full-time front-line host is supposed to sound like. At least with Rhyner sitting across the table from him.
He's a well-spoken chap, so what I'm about to say may just be his natural ease with the spoken word, but his questions to Bruce Bochy on today's interview sounded scripted.
There's a reason Cat told him, "you will never be a host." Mike admitted on-air that this exchange occured. Up For Anything Middle-Aged Going On 20-Something is a helluva fun time at the bar, at the remote with the drinky drinks, as a producer with an open mic and open invite to pop on at anytime with a wink and a smile, as someone who makes up a bit once per quarter (and even those are rather iffy in quality), and as someone who comes up with goofy titles for segments. As a host? Day in, day out; week in, week out; month in, month out; year in, year out presence? Not as currently constituted. I told you all this many times. No one wants to hear it. I get it. But I said this was going to happen if he ever got his shot. Could he improve? Improve to the point of being a legit host on a pm drive in a top 5 market? Anything's possible. But that's gonna take REAL work on his part. While he might be Up For Anything, I'm not sure if he's up for what that entails. Playing the role of So Anonymous, everyone's favorite party uncle, and galavanting around the DFW scene and checking off bespoke/bucket list concerts, F1 races, exotic vacays, et cetera and etc is, as that crap song goes, "nothin' but a good time." Doing radio, real radio, for real, with your ass on the line.....different dealio, entirely. I like the dude. Would love to have a beer or 8 and a few Jamo shots with him fer sure. Hope he figures it out. You wanted this, Chael. You got it. Now whatcha gonna do with it? Step up to the plate, son. Do a 180. Be a pro's pro. Succeed.
Cat knows talent. Ed Wallace knows what he's talking about vis-a-vis Rhynes.
Sorry. I wish it were otherwise. Truly. Maybe things will turn a 180. Again, anything's possible. Like Hendrix, I love flyin' my Freak Flag High. But shit, man, gimme some wind for that sucker. No one likes to see a limp one.
I don't see why what happens with the Freak would effect Rhyner's Godfather status at the Ticket. He earned that. He still built the Ticket. He was still an instrumental part of establishing the station, its sound and giving it the momentum that allowed it continue to be what it is today. The success of failure of the Freak really shouldn't diminish that.
None of the Beatles solo were as great as they were with the Beatles but they were still Beatles.
Love the revisionist history. Did Mike really”build” the Ticket? From what I remember reading in their book he was the PD for less than a week. I think he was the linchpin between the radio broker who knew what was for sale, and that broker guy knew the first owner who put together the money. Mike did build the air staff but let’s not forget that included Bayless. But Mike didn’t move the musers to mornings, hire Bob or Dan, promote Jake, etc. yes he was the figurehead leader. Do you really think he’s going to be invited back into the mothership? Guest for a couple songs with the time wasters? I think Mike burned that bridge.
revisionist history? I would think building the on air staff would be a a big part of building the Ticket. Unless the other host were lying for the last twenty plus years they have all given Mike the credit for building the Ticket. I think diminishing Rhyner's contributions to the Ticket would be revisionist history. I guess that could have been playing radio. I think that if the Freak fails and it would make the Ticket and Cumulus money Mike would be back at the Ticket in a heartbeat.
So let’s dig deeper. Who is Mike responsible for? At best, George, Craig, and Gordo. Everyone else was added by someone else. And that’s my point. Mike had the idea, Mike connected the people early on who got it off the ground. He became the face and figurehead of the place. But anyone besides me remember how much Mike hated Rocco Pendola? I don’t know exactly when Rocco started, but clearly by 97-98 Mike had no influence in hiring. One of the early program directors - (Mike Thomas? Bruce Gilbert?) Hired Bob, hired Dan. Catlin moved Norm from KLIF, hired Donovan, hired Jake, etc. mike started the station, but as plainsman stated above, someone has to hire and fire, guide it, program it. And I think the Freak is showing us how much Mike resented being told what to do by others.
I still think Mike has the godfather status, it's not that I think that's somehow gone now. I guess I am more trying to say, my desire to have a beer with him has gone down over the last month or so.
As you said, Rhyner brought in George, Craig, and Gordon. He also brought with him Greggo (remember him?). He too got Curt Menafee and Chuck Cooperstein onboard. And lastly, it was his idea to have Skip Bayliss kick things off. We laugh at SB now. But without his early involvement, The Ticket might've sunk. And sunk fast. Skip was THE SOLE universally known commodity at the time. He was a nationally recognized sports writer for The Dallas Times Herald and The Dallas Morning News, as well as being a contributor to SI (back when that meant something) and other publications. Everyone in the DFW knew who Skip was. What's more, back then his rep was that of a loose cannon but also a compelling writer whose inside info, no matter how outlandish prima facie, most always was dead on correct. Back then if Skip wrote it, you'd be a fool to dismiss it out of hand. Menefee was known to some exetent because of local tv work, but nothing compared to SB. Coop was only on the radar in hardcore sports geek circles. As to the rest, not one person knew they even existed. Total unknowns.
Rhyner identified and brought in all that talent. He also got the original investors (e.g. Spence) together, pitched and sold the idea. His then wife, Renee, named the station. He was instrumental in every aspect of The Ticket's founding and it's initial success. Without his efforts, insight, the attitude he instilled in all employees (on and off air) and in turn us listeners, his solid gut instincts and bullshit detector, and some luck, there would be no Ticket. All that came after him wouldn't have (because there would be no Ticket) if not for his hard work during the station's nascency. We owe him a debt of gratitude for it and what he accomplished. All that he did and the well deserved accolades that have come along with it are things that cannot be taken away from him. Nor should they or what he did be diminished.
That was Rhyner's now long ago past. Rhyner beginning around 06-'07 until today, well friends, that is another story all together.
I’m really not trying to diminish mikes role. Yes he conceptualized it, put the original team together, etc. You mentioned Spence, how much credit do you give him for getting the business of the Ticket off the ground? Without him, or KRLD when they owned them, or Dan Bennett in the Susquehanna days, now it’s Cumulus, how much credit do they get? How much credit for almost 30 years success goes to the PD’s? Mike is clearly the founder, the visionary, the figurehead. But people speak as if Mike built the station and single-handedly made every great decision of the last 30 years. But fully 2/3rds of the air staff aren’t Mike’s hires. I’ll give him a ton of credit for the idea and holding it together in the early days. But I also think there are plenty of other people who have earned at least some credit.
345, no P1 I know (and I know many) believes what you claim. All know (esp. the early adopters) the history of the station, who came to be the decision makers, and whatnot. That means they also who does and does not get credit (what's so important about that, anyways, I mean, who really cares?). Perhaps you're mistaking the majority of the reddit/Twitter crowd--which is a small but vocal minority--for the knowledge and opinions of most P1s. BTW, most listeners are Gen X to the last couple of years included in the Boomer (actual Boomer) generation....and not Millenials, not Zoomers. Reddit/Twitter gives a false impression about the reality on the ground. It's what they do best, so it seems. I think this false impression and the unmerited weight that it's given is why The Freak even exists, much less its headscratching cast of characters.
So when's Danny's first day at The Freak? Kinda thinking that ain't happening. Don't see THZ going over there either. Will bet anyone anything that IJB at least with Jake being involved is in its last days.
Spot the difference below (courtesy reddit/Ticket. Then go check out Freak reddit for yourself. No one is clamoring for or migrating over to The Freak. I've yet to finish listening to more than 3 full segments and we're a month in. Freakishly poor content.
Side note: Betcha TC tries to take The Ticket to court for using his voice on the Joel Klatt theme song. He's done likewise before.
PINNED BY MODERATORS Posted by u/AutoModerator 3 days ago Weekly Listening Thread 177 Comments
Mikey teased Rhyner about doing something on his phone or iPad while the program was going on.
Rhyner vehemently says, "I was not!" OWTTE.
Mikey, to his credit, kept at it, naming another website Rhyner was supposedly visiting (if I recall the exchange correctly).
Rhyner vehemently says again, "I was not!" OWTTE.
It didn't sound like Rhyner was playing along with a gag. He wanted people to know he wasn't goofing off.
Rhyner knows that listeners think his attention wanders to his own interests during programs, and he jumped on Mikey pretty quickly and, shall we say, sincerely, to bat that impression down.
I'm telling you as sure as the sun will rise tomorrow, there's going to be genuine behind the scenes tension --if not already brewing/there-- between Rhyner and Mike (not calling a 47 year old Mikey, sorry). It will spill over in not so subtle ways onto the airwaves. Mike can be confrontational to the point of aggressive. We've seen this during his Ticket days on several occasions. Rhyner on the other hand will not sit there and take it from the likes of Mike. He took a lot of shit from Corby and Danny, but he also believed they had skins on the wall and could hold their own. Not so with Mike. If he thought those at The Ticket had cast him off after having built their careers and lifestyles off the back of his baby, his work, then just how the f do you think he's going to feel about Mike and all the rest with this thing?
I do remember Greggo and for a time he was part of one of the most popular, must listen to shows this region has ever seen. Whatever his failures after or his train wreck personal life don’t change that fact. There’s a lot of credit to be shared around the station. It wouldn’t be what it is without the contributions of all the host. I even give Corby credit there, no matter how much I don’t like his style or attitude. It seems that some feel if you have tremendous success in one place you shouldn’t ever do anything again. Paint the Mona Lisa and you’re done. If the only measure of success for the Freak is to achieve the same level as the Ticket than they are doomed because that’s not happening. Rhyner and the others are taking a shot. A shot they clearly don’t feel they could get at the Ticket for whatever reason. There seems to be a narrative that doing that makes them bad guys some how or stupid for trying. I don’t understand why that matters to anyone who isn’t paying them.
You're creating straw men, 906. Not one person on this site has said The Freak should never have been done, that Rhyner hasn't the right to do what he pleases, or that the rest shouldn't take a shot. No one has said this implicitly or explicitly. In fact, most comments lament that The Freak thus far is rather piss poor because they'd like to see the competition in hopes of (i) making The Ticket better and (ii) having a viable, equally good if not better option. Moreover, no one has said the other Ticket hosts (and Cat and Bennett and The Laddie and Bruce Gilbert -- 'member them?) deserve no credit for The Ticket's success. Of course they do. It goes without saying. Not everything must be expressed, as some things are obvious. But as deserving as all the other players are, only Rhynes pitched and sold the idea, and assembled The Ticket talent. By the way, it was an idea that every media luminary said it would never work. Finally, not one person has said anyone involved with The Freak is a bad or stupid person. No one has stated as such. Critique the way in which The Freak has been put together, pitched to the public as, its glaring inconsistencies in message and content, its overall lack of cohesion, and its talent pool presenting said content in an often lazy and seemingly ill-prepared manner? Absolutely. It's called being in the public eye (DESIRING TO BE FOR A LIVING) and doing it in a very public way, all the while talking big and loud about it. And so far not being able to cash the check your ass is writing. One more thing: If none of matters or should matter (what does writing checks have to with it anyway, that's such a silly "argument"), then why are you here? Why would you even, nay, how do you even know MTC exists? If what we think doesn't matter, then why the hell are they doing it? Of course it matters. We're the ones (listeners) that MAKE it matter, else no one cares and no one listens and no one buys ad spots and, well you *hopefully* get the picture.
FYI I am Anon 9:06. For some reason my phone doesn't allow me to post under my google account on MTC.
I'm not arguing anything. I am not attempting to change anyone's mind. I am stating my point of view on the current discourse here. There have been a number of post that stated this was changing their opinion on Rhyner and, IMO, diminishing his role and contributions to the Ticket. I had posted that what happened with the Freak shouldn't diminish what he had done at the Ticket. Someone else brought up that other's had contributed and I wanted to clarify that I would give the same credit to any of them I give to Mike. Greggo's failures elsewhere don't have any bearing on his success at the ticket. Likewise I would understand the post claiming that Cat was right not to give Mikey or Julie larger rolls to imply that they shouldn't even be trying this because Cat knows better. I am perhaps reading more into those statements than the authors intended.
How about some Ticket content griping? The Musers/Norm and D mix this morning was an abortion and the clearest example yet of why Norm needs to go. He was barely attentive, sounded loopy asf, his dogs were causing a ruckus in the background. It was a GD mess. Donovan sounded put out as he took the handoff from Jub
There's a fairish amount of "Ticket content griping" here. The topic at hand is mostly The Freak, but sure, comparing it to things you don't care for on The Ticket is absolutely fair game.
I've mentioned, as have others, that The Invasion (which is not The Most Dangerous Midday Program) is needing some triage. Truth to tell, it misses Mike S.
Speaking of Mike S, which I just was, since I'm a Mike S fan I've been mulling over his departure from the Ticket over failure to advance, money, whatever. Others here have questioned his broadcast talent, which is fair, but from his hosting roles on Cirque and fill-in (and, effectively, a third co-host of the Invasion), I think he has the goods.
But ya know . . . sometimes people don't advance for reasons other than an adverse "talent" evaluation. Sirois is a strong personality, and, as others have pointed out, not averse to calling out JV and others on the air. Perhaps difficult or unreliable behind the scenes. Perhaps the late-adolescent party style which endears him to some schlopped over into his conduct as a day-to-day employee at The Ticket from time to time. (I haven't heard any gossip on any of these "perhaps" items.) Could have been all kinds of things that persuaded Jeff Catlin to impose a ceiling on his Ticket career other than his on-air performance.
But, as I've noted above, he is not shining on The Downbeat. I think he can, but he needs to take charge of that snoozer and kick Rhyner into the world of 21st century -- well, 21st century everything.
He sounds like someone who is taking care to be on his best behavior, but his best behavior is not the behavior that made him a candidate in the minds of many Ticket listeners, including me, to take a bigger role at the station. He's got that bigger role now, and I'm hoping he'll take advantage of it even at the risk of rubbing Rhyner the wrong way.
I don't feel the Invasion has been better after Mike S's departure. I listen to it far less. I don't know if Sirois has the talent to be a host, I just know I found him entertaining on the Invasion, Cirque and as a fill in. I too have not found him as entertaining on the Freak. I think maybe his best role is the yuck monkey role. I think the Ticket should have put him in the role Davey is currently occupying on the HL and I wonder how long the Davey thing was in the works. Is that part of why Sirois left? All things being equal I wish both he and Julie were still on the Ticket.
Like all of us, KDF, you're obviously welcome to your opinion. While you're right in saying a few commenters have said their opinion of Rhyner has changed and that at least one person even questioned if the his role in the station's founding was all it's purported to be. True enough. But in fairness to them, Rhyner has changed a lot since the mid-oughts. Some might think it's for the better, others not so much. The two (personality/founding narrative) aren't related. I agree with you and others who say regardless of The Freak's level of success or lack thereof, it should not lessen what Rhyner accomplished with The Ticket. As for Sirois and Julie and the "Cat knows talent" mantra, I don't take it as saying they shouldn't try; rather, I read it as there's a reason why Cat didn't find them or promise them future host roles, that he has a good eye for what works day in, day out and for the long haul. I have to say that one month in neither of them are shining now they're in the spotlight. So the idea that Cat knows talent and didn't see either of them as host material is thus far panning out. So far neither is anything above mediocre, if that. Unfortunately, it's true. This might very well change. We'll see. So in a nutshell, no, I don't think you're reading too much into certain statements . . . but misreading.
AS to Sirois' hosting abilities, I've said it before and will say it one final time:
It's far easier to be "on" and be everyone's favorite uncle or to be weekend dad who gets to play good cop and let's the kids do whatever they want than to have to be "on" every day, to be "on" for the grind, to have to ask Little Mary to do her homework and take a bath for the umpteenth time this week and it's only Wednesday, and to have to say, "no, we do not __" for the gazillionth time this week and it's still only Wednesday. The former was Sirois' role at The Ticket; the latter, at The Freak. BIG differnce. BIGGER responsibilities and MUCH BIGGER expectations.
So, yes, Sirois could be entertaining on CdS. Recall CdS was off more than it was on-air. It was a 2-3 hour Saturday show. Not a 3-4 hour 5 day per week show. NaD is a less than 2 hour show. When your foil is Norm, well, just who doesn't come off as funny and entertaining? (Food dor thought: Norm's decline might've been the thing that made Sirois and even Donnie to some extent more attractive.) Again, it's a less than 2 hour show and he chose his spots. Fill ins are just that, fill ins. My point is, I'm not sure exactly where all these supposed bona fides come from (?). There's more I could say but won't because mostly it's not positive and at this point (or any point, really) frankly it's moot. Forget his Ticket work, he's now a host of a pm drive show and partnered with a genuine radio legend in the 5th largest market in the USA. THIS is the hill he lives or dies on. So let's focus on his present work and not the past. And thus far his work has been underwhelming. Early days, for sure, but everything that seems like it's been around forever once had its early days. Early days are no longer early in fairly short order. One month in. It'll be six in a blink of an eye. I want Sirois to succeed. And I totally agree with KDF (and have said as much) that he's in the wrong role and most likely with the wrong partner. He needs to be on the morning show in a 3rd host/Gordo/Yuck Monkey role. I think there he would be much better set up for success.
As for Julie, I don't relish in saying this as she seems like a nice human, but I believe she's in over her head. Way too much too soon.
One more thing. Listened to the entirety of B&S today. I really wanted to get one last feel for the show. Toward the latter 3rd of the show the reason they've been the hit you'd think they would've been by now is for one thing: neither of them can tell a story. They can't. These guys are childhood buddies who have lived their entire lives in the area. They have been DFW insiders (sports, media, entertainment) for decades now. Their experiences and stories and knowing where bodies are buried knowledge should equate must-hear radio. Yet it doesn't. It boils down to neither of them being compelling communicators. They have gold material in spades and sadly are babbling dingleberries. This in turn engenders the blatantly fake overlaughing that mars every segment. Honestly, I think it's a damn shame. They should be THE show to listen to in this town.
To paraphrase Regina George, DFW radio overlords need to stop trying to make B&S happen. They’ve had the better part of a decade and a half to win a daypart at no fewer than 4 formats/stations. In a prior thread, the Plainsman of the Americans made a remark (with 100% accuracy) in response to a thought on an all female show telling market that the freak isn’t serious about that time slot. I’d go a step further and say any station continuing to give meaningful weekday hours to B&S isn’t serious about winning monthly books or it’s ongoing viability.
Which, in conjuction with having a 73 year old "I'm back, bitches" senior AARP member as the lynchpin of the station and a talent pool consisting of unknowns outside of an extremely small as in miniscule very niche pocket of social media, all tells you (if you're able to see past your toes) that this format is a place holder. It was given the green light by a now gone PD who knew he was about to exit (voluntarily or otherwise), is friends with some of the players involved, and said "fuck it, let's go, I'm out anyways so it's, ahem, no skin off my back." There is absolutely no buzz whatsover about The Freak. The moment it went live, it died. The only build up was, "Is this really happening? How or better yet why is Mike Rhyner doing this? It doesn't make sense. Who's involved, who will be involved and what was the timeline of its genesis?" That was the hype, other than the bytes spilled on Ticket minded Twitter, reddit, and the handful that inhabit this space (no offense, Plainsman, I truly dig your site/forum). Here's the rub. Those questions that were answered made no dent. The questions left unanswered (which are actually more interesting) made no dent.
The Freak is weak. Doubt me? Look at their reddit page. Look at The Ticket reddit page. Look at The Freak weekly thread vs. The Ticket weekly thread on The Ticket reddit page. Compare the comment numbers from the build up/1st few days of it going live and now. The numbers should be eye-opening to anyone involved with or hedging their bets on The Freak. Still doubt me? Listen to it. Look, I'm not going to bag on any of them personally (the dig at Rhyner's "I'm back, bitches" was more at the person who decided that a senior citizen making that statement was something the new format designed to attract edgy youth should be built around and not Rhyner. All that jazz is Rhyner's burden to bear (another comment in itself). And I'm not going to crap on the others. I don't give a rat's ass about what any of them did prior to their new stint at The Freak. I'm judging them on the here and now. So far, so bad. There's not a single show that says either "I'm great" or "I have potential for greatness." Not a one. Major shakeup by Feb 23. Dead and gone and 97.1 is a rock station again by Sept '23.
There's a lot of thoughtful speculation and conjecture on this blog. One thing, however, that needs to be kept in consideration when it comes to iHeart's committment to The Freak is that they knew what they were stepping into and knew/know it's going to take some time, even a considerable amount of time, to make real inroads. All of which is to say that iHeart believes in the format. That format is, literally, we do/say what we want. The idea pertains to the perceived (real or not) shortening of attenion spans and constant need for variety (i.e., memes), especially in the coveted demo. All of you who think that the inaugural lineup will not be a part of what will eventually be known as the "classic Freak" lineup are correct. Be forewarned, there's a very good chance personalities you have allegiance to might very well not be at The Freak sooner rather than later. Like The Ticket, The Freak too will undergo some major overhauls before it settles into a groove and finds and defines itself with the listening audience. But you can't compare the two stations. Same "founder" but way different circumstances, and in every way possible.
Is iHeart’s commitment misplaced? The BEST format for hosts saying what they please are podcasts. So who is buying this ridiculously outdated pitch? Ah yes, terrestrial radio. Plainsman-is it possible you are being too nice about some of the Freak hosts? I think some of them sound like nice people. I don’t agree that they are talented for this medium. Having been in the teaching profession for years (high school and college), lots of nice people….LOTS of poor communicators. Again, lack of professional talent for the thing they are trying to do.
In today’s version of the Invasion…you thought the show was disjointed when Norm broadcasts from home? How about Norm on the freaking phone to start the show because he can’t get the clean feed working this morning? Can someone get this octogenarian to retire already?
He's not in his 80s, therefore he's not an octogenerian. He's three years older than Rhyner. If his presence and performance offends you so much, flip over the The FAN or The Freak for those two hours.
So I wanna throw some positivity out. OK, some but not only.
First off, Monty is killing it on all levels. He has to be next in line for a serious bump in stature and status. I very much hope that when Norm retires it is Monty that gets a hosting position. Monty, like Jake before him, has earned it and has that special something that sets him apart from the rest. I'll go a step further and say he's better than Jake in that his sports acumen and sense of humor and understanding of what makes The Ticket The Ticket every bit as good as Jake's but he's also more even keeled in demeanor and is far less inclined to wear his socio-political views on his shoulders, which makes him less polarizing, more likeable. I'm really pulling for Ol' Monto.
I also want to say that I agree with the idea that Sirois is talented but has been paired with the wrong partner. If you ever heard he and Cash's interviews on CdS, you'd be hard pressed not to see that the guy has the goods. He just needs to be put in the right position to show them off. I don't think anyone is a good fit for Mike R other than Greggo. But the rub here is that if you listened to his post Ticket pods you'd also be hard pressed to see that he doesn't have much to say of interest. This includes his interviews. If not for Dale Hansen being Dale Hansen (press play and he'll go on forever with crazy story after crazy story), Eric Nadel being Eric Nadel, and so on, there wouldn't have been one episode worth your while. I'm not trying to bag on Mike R. It's been pretty well stated here just how important he was to The Ticket's founding and success and once upon a time he was (it must be said, briefly) a must listen to voice in the DFW area. But for whatever reason he lost interest in his job (it was obvious) and receded into the background and basically went on a 12 year paid vacation, a very well paid vacation at that. My hope is that The Freak pd will shake things up, pair Sirois up with someone more suitable, reconfigure the morning program, and either find Mike R a different partner or make his show something more akin to the old Galloway and Co. instead of the ball of confusion it now is. Lastly while it seems they're dug in on the we say what we want motto (lord that's dumb and played out), I hope they find some genre to center everything on and around. As is, The Freak's message and presentation of it is an abject mess.
I've been a Justin Montemayor fan for quite a long time. You've hit on something I've tried to communicate on several occasions, which is that Monty has The Ticket Sound. He (and, I'm coming to think, David Mino too), like the best Ticket hosts, is able to have a conversation on mic that sounds like a normal conversation, not like I'm being talked at by someone who's aware of my presence. Very natural, not a conventional broadcast voice. And likable, and funny, and, as you say, knowledgeable enough about sports to get by on The Ticket.
And also re Sirois. The Confessor who has been instructing us quite eloquently and at length about Sirois's experiential shortcomings seems to me to be not quite getting what all of us Sirois fans are saying. He or she is right that CdS and NaD and other fill-ins is not the same gig as a full-time host, and that the full-time host duties bring with them different requirements. But if you don't promote someone who's shown potential in several host-like roles, the alternative for The Downbeat would be to find someone who has already been a successful full-time host to pair with Rhyner. Who would that be? Poach someone from The Fan? They probably have the same noncompetes as the Ticket hosts, and they're not setting the world on fire to begin with. Cowlishaw? JJT? Also not listener draws. No, Mike S has the goods to host a show and he's a fit with the "Ticket renegade" ethos The Freak is trying to promote. 159 and others have said that he may need a new home or a new role. Sure, could be. Me, I think it could work with Rhyner, but, as I said before, he needs to become more Corby-like, take that puppy over in alliance with that nice young Michael Gruber, and let Rhyner chime in as the spirit moves him.
Some good stuff on these threads, Confessors. You can't get this stuff on Reddit. Wonder if anyone is listening.
If you credit Wikipedia, Rhyner was born in August of 1950. Which would make him 72. When you enter "how old is Mike Rhyner" on Google, you get "about 71 years." I've tried to parse his age from stuff I've heard from time to time, and I would have guessed one of those two numbers, not 73. I don't know what his Twitter feed says. Maybe he is 73, maybe he got held back or something.
But it's not what the calendar says, it's what comes through the microphone. And he sounds fine, and Norm, increasingly, does not, I'm sorry to say.
Rhyner is 72. I know it for a fact because he frequents (hint, plays at) my place of employment. No, I'm not a close friend of his, just a guy that sometimes serves him a tasty adult bev. If Wiki is to be believed Norm is 78. That means there's 6 years between the two. So pretty much everyone has been wrong in some regard. Either they got the age wrong of Rhyner or Norm or the difference in years. Can we now move on and quit having to have the last word?
Just to let you all know, Rhyner's a quiet, nice guy and tips appropriately. Usually comes in solo and has always been cool with fans who engage him. Never once seen him act like a puffed up jerk. I hope The Freak works out.
Have it on pretty damn good word that despite what might appear to many of you as discombobulation, iHeart knows exactly what they're trying to accomplish with The Freak. They are trying to give a satellite/internet radio - podcast feel. Listen to The Freak's local weekend programming. It's mainly the weekday hosts doing shows focused on music and other pet projects. The rule here is there are no rules. iHeart understands that it will take time for a format like this to take hold with listeners who get their content chiefly from terrestrial radio, as they are judged to be reluctant adopters. They also believe not having a central focal point of content is where things are going in general (think streaming services, choose your own content); that attention spans are rapidly shrinking and focusing on any one thing will sooner rather than later lose listeners. If you know anything about the data coming from Tik Tok studies and the music industry you probably understand this already. Is this the near-future? Not sure. But it is what all corporations involved in the entertainment industry are betting on. Heterogeneity is the name of the current game. It's been trending this way for years but we are finally arriving at the put up or shut up/shit or get off the pot moment. In this way The Freak's insistence that it is pathbreaking is not wholly incorrect.
So you go to the steakhouse and get steak. Maybe you’re side is a baked potato. Maybe mashed. You might be a creamed spinach type. But all of those go with your steak. I bet very few people go in and order an array of sides. Lists, games, creamed corn, bits, broccoli, music. They’re all side dishes. People go for the steak. Or the (fill in your favorite cuisine here). Some people love sides. But is a restaurant that is nothing but side dishes a mass appeal restaurant. Or radio station?
Don't doubt your sources, and thanks for passing along their news.
But The Freak has anything but a "satellite/internet radio/podcast" feel. If this is iHeart's aim, it has fatally misfired.
Satellite radio has a bunch of stations, each of which has a narrow focus.
Podcasts each have a particular subject to which it's devoted.
The Freak claims expressly that what IT has is "what we want to talk about." The exact opposite of the targeted content of SixiusXM and podcasts. That just ain't a destination unless your personalities are very compelling AS PERSONALITIES. What the Freak has is one unquestionably appealing radio personality, Mike Rhyner, who's fun to listen to but really has not much to say, a guy who really isn't dialed in to news, popular culture, or The Sosh.
iHeart can say they were doing something revolutionary and just give the revolution a little time to takoe hold, but hell -- Mike Rhyner used to HATE Ben & Skin. Mike Rhyner HATED calls. Mike Rhyner is NOT a fan of female broadcasters. Confessors have said that the thing feels tossed together. It does.
I think The Freak came about by virtue of one helluva sell job by one Mike Sirois to Mike Rhyner that was buttressed by a "you bet we can!" rah rah Ben & Skin -- all based on a small but shouting, never shutting up, ever demanding whatever it is they want in the moment niche sosh community. iHeart bit. iHeart then allowed Rhyner and Sirois with some input from B&S to assemble the on-air talent that would convey the Seinfeld-esque rally cry-mantra of "We say what we want" -- it's a show about nothing. It feels slapped together because it was. And for something of this magnitude, it was slapped together last-minute. Last-minute here meaning Since spring '22. By the way, if you take the time to scroll back through MTC threads you'll find a month and change prior to Sirois' leaving So Anonymous begins sporadically posting messages that read, "anything is possible," "everything is possible," "everything is in play." When JV, including Sirois, Jer, and Danny, left we all thought, "huh, I guess So Anon had the goods again, but seems a bit oversold." Little did we know at that time.
The Freak sounds last-minute because as far as format changes go, it is. It's also populated with talent that, other than one host, is relatively inexperienced, at least where hosting a daily show is concerned. I'm interested in seeing how this all pans out. And even more interested in the aftermath of its panning out, positively or negatively, for both The Freak and its hosts and for The Ticket and how it reacts. Count me in as team "real competition is good for everyone, but especially the listener." So go Freak, go Ticket.
Amendment to above: I know B&S have been daily hosts for a couple of decades and that Cavanaugh was on The FAN for several years. But 4 of the 8 hosts do not. They were on-air support who got air time and/or had p/t weekend shows, which is a different animal entirely. Overall, The Freak has a lot of inexperienced players involved. And this isn't College-Station, it's Dallas-Ft. Worth.
Agree with Plainsman. This comes across as B&S talked to Rhyner, and then assembled the rest from spare parts lying around the metroplex. If you’re going for a podcaster feel, why hire fan and Ticket cast offs?
Going to share a piece of news/gossip picked up this weekend. Friends with a person in radio sales. And while they’re hesitant to discuss specific numbers, will answer most questions asked. This persons point is that the Eagle was moderately successful as a rock station. Not ticket successful- they said the ticket is usually one of the top stations in the market. But that the Eagle WAS successful. Said the station has/will shed those listeners in an attempt to go for a piece of the Tickets pie. But that doing really well going after the Ticket and fan audience will get them less money than they had as a rock station. This person predicts a very short leash. That if they don’t kill in the first couple ratings books, iheart will flip. Said social media comments by Rhyner-that he may only be there for a year- is a signal that it is to paraphrase a website, “funny or die” . Success or format flip.
A Stroll Through The Downbeat
ReplyDeleteWas able to listen to a fair amount of The Downbeat yesterday. Herewith, a few observations.
(1) Mike R is now permitted to be called “Rhyner.” No more of this “Rhyner’s dead” business. I guess there are too many Mikes on the show. It seems to be shaking out that Mike R is “Rhyner” (or “Shoopy” if Michael G is addressing him), Mike S is “Mikey,” and Michael G is ”Grubes” or “Shoopy,” if Rhyner is addressing him. Krystina was on yesterday, and she’s “Krystina.”
(2) Mike has taken to saying “the little Freak” and “the little Downbeat.”
(3) The last couple of times I’ve heard the show, including yesterday, Rhyner has given a little speech along the lines of – “we’re just offering something we hope you like,” sort of a “we’re just an underdog trying something a little different, sure hope you like it” attitude. Far from the bombast of the first few days (although, truth to tell, most of the bombast I heard came from The Speakeasy and especially Ben & Skin).
(4) There was a segment on dumplings and Mike’s dislike of same. They had Mike read a menu from a dumpling restaurant, Bushi-Bushi.
(5) The Sunset Lounge featured a (somewhat confused) discussion of Daylight Savings Time.
(6) The Sunset Lounge intro is cool hipster prose, but it’s just too long. Now that the novelty has worn off, it just sounds like filler.
Continued . . .
Continuation of previous comment.
ReplyDelete(7) So we had three voices yesterday, not counting that nice young Michael Gruber. I have no idea whether the rotating group of third voices – they’re really selling the women on this frequency – is a permanent feature. I’m thinking it is. They then introduced a fourth voice and a fourth Mike, Mike “the Machine” Marshall, who was going to do a Mavericks segment that I did not hear. Before that segment, however, he was in charge of a discussion of Season 1, Episode 9, of “Game of Thrones: House of the Dragon.” Coupla things here:
First, I have a bias against these TV show discussions for two reasons: (1) If I’m not watching the show, they’re an annoying interruption at best, a bunch of insiders talking to a bunch of other insiders but not me, and a punch-out at worst. (2) If I’m watching the show, I’m more than likely recording it for viewing later, so I absolutely gotta punch out there to avoid spoilers. The Ticket does these segments too, I was never sure why Cat didn’t eliminate these; although, come to think of it, I haven’t heard any of these segments lately, but maybe my ears weren’t listening at the right time.
Second, in this particular case, I am watching GOT:HOTD and I had seen that particular show, so I was interested.
Third, and here’s the main thing I want to note: Both Mikey and Krystina are fans of the show and they had seen it and Mikey himself said that he was a particular fan. They could have had that discussion without M”tM”M. The fourth voice here (although Rhyner, who of course has seen none of these shows, wasn’t contributing anything here) was unnecessary and there was lots of talking over one another.
Fourth, M”tM”M has some really nice radio pipes. Remember, he had a weekend show on The Ticket with Justin Montemayor several years ago. He did most of the talking on this segment and while he did know his stuff, the presentation was pretty manic and I had a hard time following what he was saying, especially since Mikey and Krystina (who knew the show, remember) were also chiming in. M”tM”M is a talker, which was okay because they’d invited him on to talk, but he has a very aggressive and speedy broadcasting style that clashed somewhat with the relaxed state of affairs on The Downbeat. (All noted how confusing the names are on “House of the Dragon,” and they’re right, but M”tM”M’s use of those names didn’t help the segment.) I don’t want to overstate how muddled all of this sounded, but I think The Downbeat missed an opportunity to promote itself if full-time Freakers Mikey and Krystina had helmed that particular segment.
* * *
Here’s what The Downbeat reminds me of after a couple of weeks now: It sounds like an old AM radio show from the fifties and sixties that would air in the mornings, where the host and maybe one or two others would sit around drinking coffee (several of these hosts had the “Coffeehead” nickname in various markets), sometimes a couple of women, sometimes a man or two (Don McNeill’s Breakfast Club), or even a couple (Don and Roma in Chicago). They might spin a disk now and then. Interviews; some live performance. But those shows were mostly what I thought of as Easy Listening Talk.
And it’s not bad – I didn’t mind the dumpling and daylight-savings talk – but it’s not only not innovative, it sounds, as I’ve now said a couple of times, almost nostalgic (which, I guess, if you don’t have a nostalgia station on the dial, could be considered innovative). Even the names: “Speakeasy,” “Downbeat,” “Sunset Lounge” with its retro intro – all hearken back to a jazz-inflected social history from the middle decades of the last century. The Downbeat isn’t a broadcast disaster, but it’s either a brilliant contrast to the abrasions of Corby/Bob/Davey (just look how many Confessors have sworn off Corby, or claimed to, or want to), or a very subdued way to try to eat into The Ticket’s listenership.
(8) Rhyner still sounds good.
Eh, I think The DownBeat and The Freak as a whole is one big ball of confusion. Hell, dude, even your careful description of what was going down is confusing and a tad headache inducing. Too much, too too much. But the thing that's most glaring is that all the shows are boring. You can't keep doing what they're doing for any mid to long haul. They pretty much read lists or news/fun fact/tales of the strange items from the internet all day. Whereas shows on The Ticket have a segment or even two on most days that are like that, The Freak is just about nothing but it. Rhyner's voice sounds fine. He doesn't sound like your typical 73 year old. Then again, your typical 73 year old isn't heading up/the lead vocalist in a Petty tribute and talking about fooj's and is still (solely) interested in the same things he was in high school. Again, his voice does sound good. The content's another story. He's no different than he was during his final 6-8 years at The Ticket. Which = mailing it in and letting others carry the load. OK, fine. But it all registers a zilch on the compelling content scale. I'm not going to get into the other various and sundry Mikes nor Krystina nor Julie nor the rest. Rhyner is the reason anyone tunes in and he's the reason any of it came together in the first place. So he's the focal point. The Freak succeeds or flops because of Rhyner. BYW, you must've not listened well the first week +, because Rhyner was right there with the rest of them talking smack. He was/still is talking it via Twitter. All of this is pretty opaque and the pattern is readily discerned. Rhyner's not a complex dude. Nothing wrong with that, at all. From the jump (and you weren't around so you can't know) this whole thing has been a get in the Way Back Machine with Mr Peabody and Sherman situation. Rhyner's trying his damnedest to recreate/relive that time. Problem is this is a new day, times and the environment are much much different, and most importantly, the level of the talent he did assemble all those years ago is on an entirely different plane.
ReplyDeleteSorry about the headache, 507.
ReplyDeleteOh so many issues.
ReplyDelete1-why so many guest hosts on the downbeat. We have yet to hear just m&m.
2- bad positioning. “We talk about what we want”. How about what we, the listeners, want? The great philosopher Dan MCDowell said do the show for the p-1s. Do the p-1s really want an unending stream of shows that talk about their shows, with a mix in of made up game shows?
3- AM drive in a top 5 market and they feed us a show of 3 inexperienced chuckleheads, none of which have ever carried, or even co-carried a show. Cavanaugh was one of 4-5 guys on G bag, KT was a producer, Julie a ticker person. Go hire folks like Jagger, Jody dean, or Jasmine Sadry, people who have had ratings success in the past.
4- read that b&s have been through 5 stations in like 10+ years. 1310, live 105, espn, fan, eagle. Tells me they aren’t good enough to be kept around. They fill a roll, but aren’t worth a long term contract. Why do we think this stop will be different?
5- I don’t buy the hang zone rumors for a second. Unless I heart spends either stupid money or stupid contract length, who gives up a job on a Marconi winning station where your the heir apparent to move up, to go to a station they could flip back tomorrow. Google d&m contract and says they inked long term deal in 2019. I don’t know what long term means, but say 5 years. If you’re I heart do you sign hang zone to long term deal before station has established itself?
No need to apologize, Plainsman. It wasn't your prose, it was the fact that you accurately described the situation and that even the description is confusing. THAT'S how incoherent TDB (and all the shows) is.
ReplyDeleteWord is The Freak's was on thin ice before the needle dropped. . . . . . . . iHeart got 99 problems and The Freak ain't one.
ReplyDeleteTake that as you may and carry on.
The Freak is or is not a problem?
ReplyDeleteCooked before launch, pal.
ReplyDeleteI would think it is in thin ice. The market manager and station PD get fired right before launch. You have a morning show that is a collection of random parts going up against Marconi winning competitors. The midday show is on their 5th station, and they’ve never done really well at any of them. And your drive home is led by a cranky old dude who’s already retired once. Not exactly a recipe for success. And everyone I talk to asks the same question. What are they? They’re not sports. They’re not tradition talk -ie either news or politics- . They may be blazing new ground, but are there listeners there?
Delete“We’re not a sports station” and it’s Sunday morning and you’re running a sports betting program? What you tell me and what I hear don’t match.
ReplyDeleteComments to this site have plummeted. This is not an authoritative metric, but it sure seems like P1 ears listened, but have gradually dribbled back to The Little One. Not much more to say about The Freak.
ReplyDeleteThere's nothing wrong with an Easy Talk format, but it's just not going to attract the Hang Zone/Hard Line audience.
We may well see a peak in KEGL numbers for the current quarter as Freak-curious people tuned in based on the "I'm Back, Bitches/We Say What We Want" hype, but I have a hard time seeing that sustained for such a mild product.
He's back; but what is he back from? As the days go by, it's sounding more and more like he's back from Checkout Mike.
Ticket note: I'm a little surprised they're doing Cowboys Theater 1310 again. I was surprised they were able to do it at all, because I thought they would probably run into trouble with The Niffle over their "descriptions and accounts" of a live game. When this popular bit disappeared several years ago, I thought that some legal reason like that may have been the cause of its demise.
ReplyDeleteBut: It's back, bitches, so either they squared things with The Niffle or . . . I was wrong.
Go check out The Freak reddit page. Pretty barren. Mostly threads overtly ginned up by Freak employees populated with 0-4 comments. Peppered throughout, too, are thin-skinned pop ins by Cavanaugh, KT, and Sirois. Freak freak out (pro and con) on The Ticket reddit site has also dwindled down to a trickle.
ReplyDelete10/23, 9:29 am makes a very good point. Surely the format change was signed off on long before the PD left. At the very least it was given the OK at some time prior to his departure. That the PD left/was let go (don't know which) right before The Freak went live and that The Freak doesn't yet have a permanent PD speaks volumes about iHeart's committment to The Freak. I have to believe it's on a very short leash and barring something akin to the magic of The Ticket's nascent days, I also have to believe there's a very good chance The Freak no longer exists before the end of May '23. It could come as soon as Jan. 2 '23. Plainsman, I think, is correct in saying their best book will be their first, that that will be the high point, everything going downhill from there. As it stands, the station is such a mess, it's message so mixed, it's very structure (hosts, etc.) so confusing, that it might already be beyond rescue. That the only hope of saving the format is to either come out and officially state they are indeed a sports station, but one of a different sort (sports with an emphasis on lifestyle/entertainment), stop show mixing and establish regularity and continuity and therefore allow host pairings to gel and set their own unique tone, and in conjunction, have TSE and B&S swap timeslots. Even with these changes, it might already be too late.
Plainsman, do you have a MTC email address? I have a theory but I'm not terribly comfortable with publishing it. Yet I would like to know what you think. Perhaps you'll find it OK to publish. Nothing untold or anything like that. But it is a conjecture based on years of observing certain personalities in the parties involved in the Ticket/Freak "issue" at hand.
Sure, love to hear from you, 325.
ReplyDeleteThePlainsman1310@gmail.com
Not case-sensitive.
I'll publicize if appropriate and give due, if anonymous, credit.
Will The Freak get a bounce from Mavs season? They do talk sports some. But if they're not Mavs-intensive during the broadcast day, will there be any reason to listen to it rather than The Ticket? I dunno.
ReplyDeleteDoesn't KRLD get a bit of a pop during Cowboys season?
Riddle: What Dallas radio station is associated with the following description that shows up under the link when you search for its website on Google?
ReplyDelete"Local, personality-driven, lifestyle talk-radio hosted by a beastly creative of renegades, outlaws & risk-takers."
Hardline Proper Rhyner would've have made fun of that until the end of time. He would have been relentless in his tearing that and those associated with into shreds. Oh Mike, good sir, what HAVE we done?
ReplyDeleteEd Wallace will soon enough be proven right about Rhyner.
Jeff Caitlin knows real talent. Obversely, he knows what it isn't.
I don't want to be critical about talent levels, per se. Each of the individuals on The Freak has talent, and, I daresay, broadcast talent. Julie, Jeff, Kevin, Ben, Skin, Krystina, and each and every Mike, some more than others, but no one who is awful on radio.
ReplyDeleteBut man, talent isn't enough.
You've got to place it properly.
You've got to team it properly.
You've got to, yes, program it properly.
You've got to lead, guide it properly.
You've got to promote it properly (and truthfully).
You've got to massage/fix/boss it when it doesn't work as it's supposed to.
You've got to hang it on some kind of structure or format that listeners will recognize when they tune in.
You've got to plan for its deployment before you toss it onto the air with a hugely overblown promotional blast it can't possibly live up to.
Talent isn't enough.
Just ask the 1984-1989 Chicago Bulls.
around town began to see the new billboards that simply feature an illustration of (only) Rhyner, w/ his name beneath him, station logo to the left and "I'm Back!" to the right. This whole endeavor just reinforces the idea, at its center, is about Mike wanting everything to be about Mike. Consider the fact he now is publicly admitting to being sore the Ticket - in his head - had stopped being about him. No Rhyner, no new station - and that's ironically station's singular strongest and weakest link.
ReplyDeleteThe promotion and heavy sosh presence is why I don't think iHeart has just thrown this up until something better comes along. It's making a considerable financial investment in both conventional promotion (billboards, conventional media coverage) and all the peripheral stuff (social media). I think they think they have a unique story to sell here -- all those ex-Ticket renegades and outlaws and risk-takers.
ReplyDeleteWhether the product matches the narrative -- not so far, but it's early.
And don't downplay the value of those advertising dollars.
meh. the cost internal to iHeart of co-company promotional (they own the billboards) is really minimal. they've done zero other promotion and social doesn't count as it's a zero-cost add on since they have a person who was doing that for them anyway. The media coverage was pretty average (for they type of story it was at the time) and since then has evaporated.
DeleteP-Man,
ReplyDeleteIn regards to your 12:59 on 10/23:
I think they stopped Cowboy Theatre mostly because the hosts didn't want to schlep up to the station on a Sunday. I certainly don't think the Ticket is panicking over the Freak, but I also don't think it's a coincidence that the station brought back Cowboy Theater and all the host cross pollinations at this particular time.
Adding . . .
ReplyDeleteCovid was also a factor in the discontinuation of Cowboy Theater.
Maybe, 1054, but Freak billboard ads on iHeart signs mean they're foregoing paying customers. That kind of promotion almost certainly is an expense on the local radio budget. Time spent on every Freak promotion means those people aren't working on other iHeart projects. iHeart continues to climb out of bankruptcy, and its main focus is on digital/podcasts. There are no drops in any buckets. I haven't seen any recent reports, but iHeart lost $48.7 million in its first quarter.
ReplyDeleteQuite aside from the financial commitment, the Freak launch was loud and impressive. iHeart isn't trying to hide this property until it decides on something else. It's banking on it being successful.
we can agree to disagree on the quality of the station's launch. What we do agree on is that iHeart is treating this about as seriously as they do any station launch in these post-bankruptcy times. I also agree with 0119 that the theme'ing of these boards, whatever they cost, are speaking exclusively to a very niche audience.
DeleteI’ll try to phrase this nicely. The ticket is a niche station because they do really well, like REALLY well, in a demo that advertisers covet. Their ratings aren’t earth shaking, they’re good, but ticket isn’t a mass appeal station. Few people outside the sports radio biosphere know who Rhyner is. So basing your marketing on “I’m back” when most people will see the name/face and ask “who are you” seems frankly, dumb. Which makes me think this is about ego more than anything. But ok, he’s back. But who does Rhyner appeal to? Sports talk listeners? Disgruntled ticket listeners who think (insert your own issues here- too woke, too much Corby, not enough callers, not enough sports, too many commercials, see ticket reddit for exhaustive never ending litany of complaints) ? So you’re directly appealing to ticket listeners with “local personality driven lifestyle talk”? And Gordon keith has a radio arrest under his belt. Is any one on 97-1 really a renegade or outlaw? Gluten free Julie Dobbs a risk taker? Please, she orders gluten free pizza! So you’re marketing in a way designed to appeal to sports talk fans, using Rhyner, and serving up something completely different. Ask people what they wanted in Dallas radio, and I bet local personality driven lifestyle talk radio wasn’t high on the request list. So yes they’re marketing, with a product that, as mentioned above, is being met with a great big “meh”. And once you’ve gotten a reputation do you know how hard it is to rebrand? People will see the billboards and I’m sure some will sample the station. But how many are going to say “you know I really don’t care about sports teams, give me more game show knock offs and readings of internet lists, because I love renegades outlaws and risk takers doing lifestyle talk, it’s what I live for”.
ReplyDeleteThank you for phrasing it nicely.
ReplyDeleteapologies if my previous reply was not polite in its tone. not intended as such.
DeleteAdmittedly in my car quite a bit over the weekend, but I saw multiple billboards. I even saw the face of Grubes. Can you imagine the mothership dishing out cash to promote anybody not named George, Craig, or Gordon?
ReplyDeleteHow many years have we heard those who muse so gently joke about the inability to get on billboards? Plainsman mentioned ad dollars earlier, and that’s a good observation. This thing has to have significant financial backing, otherwise you can’t pay all these people they’ve added.
But why in earth would you promote a board op? I mean I like Grubes he’s a fun Twitter follow, but is there an adult in the room asking why they’re doing what they’re doing. It seems like there isn’t. They’re promoting this station like it’s an established brand, and it’s not .
DeleteOnly one answer to the preceding excellent questions:
ReplyDeleteiHeart believes The Freak is a real alternative to The Ticket, and they are aiming squarely, and almost exclusively, at Ticket listeners in the demo. People who do know who Grubes is (assuming they've been listening for some number of years), and who certainly know who Rhyner is.
But my Jah, what makes them think Ticket listeners, most of whom are pretty hard-core when it comes to loving the Ticket, are going to be attracted to the bland happy talk and force-fed-females the Freak has been timidly offering so far?
It's like, as someone said above, someone thinks the Reddit griping represents massive discontent among the P1. (I know, people gripe here too. But no one who understands the overnegativity of The Sosh would mistake Reddit/MTC griping for a portable listener base.)
As I said: There may be a market for Easy Talk radio, and there may be enough people who like that not-too-challenging format to make The Freak successful. I just don't see them coming from the greater body of Ticket listeners.
Live by The Sosh, die by The Sosh.
MANY years ago, I sent an email to PMAN, describing my listening day. My 10-noon is when I would schedule meetings, it was only Norm then, but I was good with that. I still don't listen a ton during that time, I really like Donovan and Norm, I just have stuff.
ReplyDeleteAnd, something thrown out earlier is interesting. A 10-1, or some such, all female show. I think a LOT of V1s would be interested in a sportsy "girl" show in that slot. If you had Julie, Kristina and Emily, you could do a weekly hockey and baseball show, plus whatever else they come up with. I would actually tune in for both those segments, then go back to the little one.
I think we, as P1s, are looking at this from a myopic perspective. I really think the Freak is intended to be an all day Kidd Kraddick show. Granted, they are very dynamic right now, which leads me to believe they aren't sure who to put where. Almost like a pick-up game. We got the court, now what?
Regardless of the outcome, it is good fodder. Haven't seen MTC this busy in a while.
specific to the comment in your 1st paragraph. iHeart historically is a research driven company. it isn't out of reach to wonder if they did some market research in deciding what to flip KEGL to, and saw something that told them KTCK is vulnerable - and if they got Rhyner - they might be able to steal ad dollars.
ReplyDeleteTotally disagree. They were a research driven company. Now they’re purely a bottom line driven station where every decision is based on how much immediate payoff -or cost - to the p&l statement. And if you think I’m wrong, tell me what kind of shoddy research tells you to market the station as, and I quote- “local personality driven lifestyle talk radio hosted by a beastly collection of renegades, outlaws, and risk takers”. Is someone seriously going to try to sell me on the idea that “beastly” research’s well? That a focus group said we like renegades and outlaws? I’ve got more to say, it involves Rhyner ego, that I may write up and send to the Plainsman.
Deletemy only push back is tied to your P+L reference. Talk is the most expensive format, by a mile, to put on. There are a few music formats they could have launched that would have filled a hole in the market, but would have likely lost all the existing clients & dollars (endorsement and otherwise) they enjoyed with KEGL and pursued w/ the main goal - Ticket's money machine. While the entire thing has the air of something thrown together with little thought - research or not - it's chasing the Ticket's 2x revenue stream is the whole point of this venture.
DeletePman:
ReplyDeleteYou invoked Kidd Kraddick. I'll go you one better. Ron Chapman. As a native Dallasite, Rhyner followed Chapman from his days as Irving Harrigan to his glory years on KVIL.
Anom 9:06
ReplyDeleteSince you invoked Kidd Kraddick, how about Howard Stern. Stern was always an apple in Rhyner's eye and he has said so many times. I doubt however there are many eagles listeners still around that remember him being on the air there.
An all-female show from 9-Noon might fill a niche in this market. Is there a female-hosted sportsy show anywhere else in the nation?
You beat me to the punch. The Freak is absolutely Mike R trying to channel his warm and fuzzies for 80s and 90s Stern
DeleteWell, Downbeat took calls, yesterday. I only heard part of it, joined in the middle of a very manic call from someone who greatly amused the group, but I think one needed to hear the whole call to get what was funny. (I'm not sure who the group was. Rhyner and Mikey and Grubes, but there was another voice I wasn't sure about. Maybe Ben?) Then someone purporting to be, and apparently was, Greg Williams's sister, who loves Greggo and wanted Rhyner to be nice to him. He said he was nice to him; said he "loved Greggo."
ReplyDeleteRhyner famously hated taking calls at The Ticket, and he didn't seem entirely with the program yesterday. They did a 15-second post-mortem after the segment, and there seemed to be some ambivalence about whether it had worked. But they said they'd try again.
From a 2015 article, possibly quite out of date, but:
ReplyDelete"A 2015 ranking by website Talkers.com of the top 100 sports talk shows included only one woman, CBS Sports Radio Network's Amy Lawrence at No. 98. She is the only woman in the country with her own national show five nights a week."
The Fabulous Sports Babe was last heard from in 2001.
But sure, worth a try.
No doubt Ron Chapman heavily influenced Mike R. But Chapman (and KISS era Kraddick) never ran on a platform of “we say what we want”, it was broad based happy talk that targeted female listeners. The Freak and all associated bluster is Mike R trying to re-create the aura of one of his other radio leaders, Stern. He’s talked before about how big a fan he was of Howard’s show when it first came to DFW. I think he’s always wanted to do a show like that, unfettered by the structure of sports talk. So he sold iHeart on it, brought on friends that won’t challenge him (on the air or behind the scenes) that will feel indebted to him for getting them back on/keeping them on the air, and now we have the Freak starring a washed boomer telling the same 30-40 year old stories to the delighted over laughing of his minions. Congrats Mike, you did recreate the Howard Stern show, except it’s today’s Stern, not the 1980s version you wanted
ReplyDeleteAs someone who posts lots of Chicago adjacent material here, I'm surprised you're not aware of the Ticket's own Sports Leila and her success in Chicago sports radio
ReplyDeletehttps://chicago.suntimes.com/2022/3/22/22991583/leila-rahimi-sports-anchor-nbc-5-chicago-the-score-dan-bernstein-nbc-sports-chicago
After my time in Chicago, and before my time in Dallas.
ReplyDeleteDan Bernstein was/is a great sports radio talker. Smart as hell, he'd be great on The Ticket. His sister Bonnie is an accomplished sports broadcaster, journalist, and executive.
I'm just gonna go off on a little bit of a tangent. What upsets me the most about the whole Freak thing, is how it's changed my opinion of Rhyner. I used to think of him, like many P1's or hosts do, as the godfather. Now I just can't think of him that way.
ReplyDelete- The attempt at podcasts seemed ok in the way that he could do them as he pleases, but also such a give up, because that still needed to be more often if he wanted anyone to care.
- The Irish exit was kinda cool but a little odd and made him seem like he thought he was Daft Punk revealing his identity or something.
- Then comes back at another station, at his old time slot, directly competing with, what on air came off of as friends. Yes they are coworkers, but a huge plus of the ticket is that they 'hang out.' Super bowls, campounds, GNO, summer bash, etc. They either are, or give the allusion, of being friends.
- To act like the ticket somehow wronged him in anyway similar to how Sirois was wronged. I'm sure Rhyner was honestly being paid too much for how much he was trying at the end, and to act like he's now in it with Sirois. Also, do we know that board ops, or producers are getting paid any better at the freak? I mean If Sirois is simply making more money because he's a host now, he's not really doing any better than Cumulus would. Also makes me think of the comments from Rhyner, I think directed at Sirois, about how he wouldn't even look at him when they shared a hotel room.
- The return video of him showing back up in the chair, once again, shows he's pretty full of himself.
- With Rhyner's recent sports opinions being of "Luka will leave" and "Cooper Rush should be QB1" Makes me think he should avoid sports honestly.
Sorry for the rant with there being actual good discussion going on, I just have been thinking about how my perception of Rhyner has changed a lot through all of this.
iHeart does supposedly pay substantially more for producers/board ops
ReplyDeleteHeard most of the Downbeat interview with Bruce Bochy. Sounded good but, of course, it was sports, so I covered my ears for most of it.
ReplyDeleteI really regret leaving this comment, so you may wonder why I'm leaving it at all.
ReplyDeleteBut I say what I want, and sometimes when I don't want.
I'm a Mike Sirois fan. Loved Cirque, loved him on middays, loved him filling in. Was looking forward to hearing him with Rhyner.
But he does not sound comfortable at all on The Downbeat.
I can't put my finger on it. It's not that he's still ring-kissing. Nothing overt, anyway. But he sounds like he's being really, really careful. Somewhat formal. Speaking very slowly. Like he's not entirely sure what a full-time front-line host is supposed to sound like. At least with Rhyner sitting across the table from him.
He's a well-spoken chap, so what I'm about to say may just be his natural ease with the spoken word, but his questions to Bruce Bochy on today's interview sounded scripted.
Let 'er rip, Mikey. This is your shot.
I think he’s so awkward try hard right now. I loved Mikey on 1310.
ReplyDeleteThere's a reason Cat told him, "you will never be a host." Mike admitted on-air that this exchange occured. Up For Anything Middle-Aged Going On 20-Something is a helluva fun time at the bar, at the remote with the drinky drinks, as a producer with an open mic and open invite to pop on at anytime with a wink and a smile, as someone who makes up a bit once per quarter (and even those are rather iffy in quality), and as someone who comes up with goofy titles for segments. As a host? Day in, day out; week in, week out; month in, month out; year in, year out presence? Not as currently constituted. I told you all this many times. No one wants to hear it. I get it. But I said this was going to happen if he ever got his shot. Could he improve? Improve to the point of being a legit host on a pm drive in a top 5 market? Anything's possible. But that's gonna take REAL work on his part. While he might be Up For Anything, I'm not sure if he's up for what that entails. Playing the role of So Anonymous, everyone's favorite party uncle, and galavanting around the DFW scene and checking off bespoke/bucket list concerts, F1 races, exotic vacays, et cetera and etc is, as that crap song goes, "nothin' but a good time." Doing radio, real radio, for real, with your ass on the line.....different dealio, entirely. I like the dude. Would love to have a beer or 8 and a few Jamo shots with him fer sure. Hope he figures it out. You wanted this, Chael. You got it. Now whatcha gonna do with it? Step up to the plate, son. Do a 180. Be a pro's pro. Succeed.
ReplyDeleteCat knows talent. Ed Wallace knows what he's talking about vis-a-vis Rhynes.
Sorry. I wish it were otherwise. Truly. Maybe things will turn a 180. Again, anything's possible. Like Hendrix, I love flyin' my Freak Flag High. But shit, man, gimme some wind for that sucker. No one likes to see a limp one.
I don't see why what happens with the Freak would effect Rhyner's Godfather status at the Ticket. He earned that. He still built the Ticket. He was still an instrumental part of establishing the station, its sound and giving it the momentum that allowed it continue to be what it is today. The success of failure of the Freak really shouldn't diminish that.
ReplyDeleteNone of the Beatles solo were as great as they were with the Beatles but they were still Beatles.
Love the revisionist history. Did Mike really”build” the Ticket? From what I remember reading in their book he was the PD for less than a week. I think he was the linchpin between the radio broker who knew what was for sale, and that broker guy knew the first owner who put together the money. Mike did build the air staff but let’s not forget that included Bayless. But Mike didn’t move the musers to mornings, hire Bob or Dan, promote Jake, etc. yes he was the figurehead leader. Do you really think he’s going to be invited back into the mothership? Guest for a couple songs with the time wasters? I think Mike burned that bridge.
ReplyDeleterevisionist history? I would think building the on air staff would be a a big part of building the Ticket. Unless the other host were lying for the last twenty plus years they have all given Mike the credit for building the Ticket. I think diminishing Rhyner's contributions to the Ticket would be revisionist history. I guess that could have been playing radio. I think that if the Freak fails and it would make the Ticket and Cumulus money Mike would be back at the Ticket in a heartbeat.
ReplyDeleteSo let’s dig deeper. Who is Mike responsible for? At best, George, Craig, and Gordo. Everyone else was added by someone else. And that’s my point. Mike had the idea, Mike connected the people early on who got it off the ground. He became the face and figurehead of the place. But anyone besides me remember how much Mike hated Rocco Pendola? I don’t know exactly when Rocco started, but clearly by 97-98 Mike had no influence in hiring. One of the early program directors - (Mike Thomas? Bruce Gilbert?) Hired Bob, hired Dan. Catlin moved Norm from KLIF, hired Donovan, hired Jake, etc. mike started the station, but as plainsman stated above, someone has to hire and fire, guide it, program it. And I think the Freak is showing us how much Mike resented being told what to do by others.
DeleteI still think Mike has the godfather status, it's not that I think that's somehow gone now. I guess I am more trying to say, my desire to have a beer with him has gone down over the last month or so.
ReplyDeleteYes, let's do dig deeper:
ReplyDeleteAs you said, Rhyner brought in George, Craig, and Gordon. He also brought with him Greggo (remember him?). He too got Curt Menafee and Chuck Cooperstein onboard. And lastly, it was his idea to have Skip Bayliss kick things off. We laugh at SB now. But without his early involvement, The Ticket might've sunk. And sunk fast. Skip was THE SOLE universally known commodity at the time. He was a nationally recognized sports writer for The Dallas Times Herald and The Dallas Morning News, as well as being a contributor to SI (back when that meant something) and other publications. Everyone in the DFW knew who Skip was. What's more, back then his rep was that of a loose cannon but also a compelling writer whose inside info, no matter how outlandish prima facie, most always was dead on correct. Back then if Skip wrote it, you'd be a fool to dismiss it out of hand. Menefee was known to some exetent because of local tv work, but nothing compared to SB. Coop was only on the radar in hardcore sports geek circles. As to the rest, not one person knew they even existed. Total unknowns.
Rhyner identified and brought in all that talent. He also got the original investors (e.g. Spence) together, pitched and sold the idea. His then wife, Renee, named the station. He was instrumental in every aspect of The Ticket's founding and it's initial success. Without his efforts, insight, the attitude he instilled in all employees (on and off air) and in turn us listeners, his solid gut instincts and bullshit detector, and some luck, there would be no Ticket. All that came after him wouldn't have (because there would be no Ticket) if not for his hard work during the station's nascency. We owe him a debt of gratitude for it and what he accomplished. All that he did and the well deserved accolades that have come along with it are things that cannot be taken away from him. Nor should they or what he did be diminished.
That was Rhyner's now long ago past. Rhyner beginning around 06-'07 until today, well friends, that is another story all together.
Welp, we found Mikes alt account, and now we know Mike reads MTC
Delete^yep
ReplyDeleteminimizing what Rhyner did to start the thing is just dumb.
but also the last sentence is exactly right. He lost his fastball a long time ago and it's not back and I see no signs of it ever coming back
I’m really not trying to diminish mikes role. Yes he conceptualized it, put the original team together, etc. You mentioned Spence, how much credit do you give him for getting the business of the Ticket off the ground? Without him, or KRLD when they owned them, or Dan Bennett in the Susquehanna days, now it’s Cumulus, how much credit do they get? How much credit for almost 30 years success goes to the PD’s? Mike is clearly the founder, the visionary, the figurehead. But people speak as if Mike built the station and single-handedly made every great decision of the last 30 years. But fully 2/3rds of the air staff aren’t Mike’s hires. I’ll give him a ton of credit for the idea and holding it together in the early days. But I also think there are plenty of other people who have earned at least some credit.
ReplyDeleteThat's a terrible bit, 3:25. Go back to reddit.
ReplyDelete345, no P1 I know (and I know many) believes what you claim. All know (esp. the early adopters) the history of the station, who came to be the decision makers, and whatnot. That means they also who does and does not get credit (what's so important about that, anyways, I mean, who really cares?). Perhaps you're mistaking the majority of the reddit/Twitter crowd--which is a small but vocal minority--for the knowledge and opinions of most P1s. BTW, most listeners are Gen X to the last couple of years included in the Boomer (actual Boomer) generation....and not Millenials, not Zoomers. Reddit/Twitter gives a false impression about the reality on the ground. It's what they do best, so it seems. I think this false impression and the unmerited weight that it's given is why The Freak even exists, much less its headscratching cast of characters.
ReplyDeleteSo when's Danny's first day at The Freak? Kinda thinking that ain't happening. Don't see THZ going over there either. Will bet anyone anything that IJB at least with Jake being involved is in its last days.
ReplyDeleteSpot the difference below (courtesy reddit/Ticket. Then go check out Freak reddit for yourself. No one is clamoring for or migrating over to The Freak. I've yet to finish listening to more than 3 full segments and we're a month in. Freakishly poor content.
ReplyDeleteSide note: Betcha TC tries to take The Ticket to court for using his voice on the Joel Klatt theme song. He's done likewise before.
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ReplyDeleteThe best thing I've heard on the station so far.
Rhyner and Mikey.
Mikey teased Rhyner about doing something on his phone or iPad while the program was going on.
Rhyner vehemently says, "I was not!" OWTTE.
Mikey, to his credit, kept at it, naming another website Rhyner was supposedly visiting (if I recall the exchange correctly).
Rhyner vehemently says again, "I was not!" OWTTE.
It didn't sound like Rhyner was playing along with a gag. He wanted people to know he wasn't goofing off.
Rhyner knows that listeners think his attention wanders to his own interests during programs, and he jumped on Mikey pretty quickly and, shall we say, sincerely, to bat that impression down.
Was he goofing off? Or was Mikey teasing?
I wish we knew.
First off you have to get Rhyner to stop obsessing over live band pics.
ReplyDeleteI'm telling you as sure as the sun will rise tomorrow, there's going to be genuine behind the scenes tension --if not already brewing/there-- between Rhyner and Mike (not calling a 47 year old Mikey, sorry). It will spill over in not so subtle ways onto the airwaves. Mike can be confrontational to the point of aggressive. We've seen this during his Ticket days on several occasions. Rhyner on the other hand will not sit there and take it from the likes of Mike. He took a lot of shit from Corby and Danny, but he also believed they had skins on the wall and could hold their own. Not so with Mike. If he thought those at The Ticket had cast him off after having built their careers and lifestyles off the back of his baby, his work, then just how the f do you think he's going to feel about Mike and all the rest with this thing?
ReplyDelete538: But . . . but . . . it's what he wants to talk about.
ReplyDelete69
ReplyDeleteI do remember Greggo and for a time he was part of one of the most popular, must listen to shows this region has ever seen. Whatever his failures after or his train wreck personal life don’t change that fact. There’s a lot of credit to be shared around the station. It wouldn’t be what it is without the contributions of all the host. I even give Corby credit there, no matter how much I don’t like his style or attitude. It seems that some feel if you have tremendous success in one place you shouldn’t ever do anything again. Paint the Mona Lisa and you’re done. If the only measure of success for the Freak is to achieve the same level as the Ticket than they are doomed because that’s not happening. Rhyner and the others are taking a shot. A shot they clearly don’t feel they could get at the Ticket for whatever reason. There seems to be a narrative that doing that makes them bad guys some how or stupid for trying. I don’t understand why that matters to anyone who isn’t paying them.
ReplyDeleteYou're creating straw men, 906. Not one person on this site has said The Freak should never have been done, that Rhyner hasn't the right to do what he pleases, or that the rest shouldn't take a shot. No one has said this implicitly or explicitly. In fact, most comments lament that The Freak thus far is rather piss poor because they'd like to see the competition in hopes of (i) making The Ticket better and (ii) having a viable, equally good if not better option. Moreover, no one has said the other Ticket hosts (and Cat and Bennett and The Laddie and Bruce Gilbert -- 'member them?) deserve no credit for The Ticket's success. Of course they do. It goes without saying. Not everything must be expressed, as some things are obvious. But as deserving as all the other players are, only Rhynes pitched and sold the idea, and assembled The Ticket talent. By the way, it was an idea that every media luminary said it would never work. Finally, not one person has said anyone involved with The Freak is a bad or stupid person. No one has stated as such. Critique the way in which The Freak has been put together, pitched to the public as, its glaring inconsistencies in message and content, its overall lack of cohesion, and its talent pool presenting said content in an often lazy and seemingly ill-prepared manner? Absolutely. It's called being in the public eye (DESIRING TO BE FOR A LIVING) and doing it in a very public way, all the while talking big and loud about it. And so far not being able to cash the check your ass is writing. One more thing: If none of matters or should matter (what does writing checks have to with it anyway, that's such a silly "argument"), then why are you here? Why would you even, nay, how do you even know MTC exists? If what we think doesn't matter, then why the hell are they doing it? Of course it matters. We're the ones (listeners) that MAKE it matter, else no one cares and no one listens and no one buys ad spots and, well you *hopefully* get the picture.
ReplyDeleteFYI I am Anon 9:06. For some reason my phone doesn't allow me to post under my google account on MTC.
ReplyDeleteI'm not arguing anything. I am not attempting to change anyone's mind. I am stating my point of view on the current discourse here. There have been a number of post that stated this was changing their opinion on Rhyner and, IMO, diminishing his role and contributions to the Ticket. I had posted that what happened with the Freak shouldn't diminish what he had done at the Ticket. Someone else brought up that other's had contributed and I wanted to clarify that I would give the same credit to any of them I give to Mike. Greggo's failures elsewhere don't have any bearing on his success at the ticket. Likewise I would understand the post claiming that Cat was right not to give Mikey or Julie larger rolls to imply that they shouldn't even be trying this because Cat knows better. I am perhaps reading more into those statements than the authors intended.
How about some Ticket content griping? The Musers/Norm and D mix this morning was an abortion and the clearest example yet of why Norm needs to go. He was barely attentive, sounded loopy asf, his dogs were causing a ruckus in the background. It was a GD mess. Donovan sounded put out as he took the handoff from Jub
ReplyDeleteThere's a fairish amount of "Ticket content griping" here. The topic at hand is mostly The Freak, but sure, comparing it to things you don't care for on The Ticket is absolutely fair game.
ReplyDeleteI've mentioned, as have others, that The Invasion (which is not The Most Dangerous Midday Program) is needing some triage. Truth to tell, it misses Mike S.
Speaking of Mike S, which I just was, since I'm a Mike S fan I've been mulling over his departure from the Ticket over failure to advance, money, whatever. Others here have questioned his broadcast talent, which is fair, but from his hosting roles on Cirque and fill-in (and, effectively, a third co-host of the Invasion), I think he has the goods.
ReplyDeleteBut ya know . . . sometimes people don't advance for reasons other than an adverse "talent" evaluation. Sirois is a strong personality, and, as others have pointed out, not averse to calling out JV and others on the air. Perhaps difficult or unreliable behind the scenes. Perhaps the late-adolescent party style which endears him to some schlopped over into his conduct as a day-to-day employee at The Ticket from time to time. (I haven't heard any gossip on any of these "perhaps" items.) Could have been all kinds of things that persuaded Jeff Catlin to impose a ceiling on his Ticket career other than his on-air performance.
But, as I've noted above, he is not shining on The Downbeat. I think he can, but he needs to take charge of that snoozer and kick Rhyner into the world of 21st century -- well, 21st century everything.
He sounds like someone who is taking care to be on his best behavior, but his best behavior is not the behavior that made him a candidate in the minds of many Ticket listeners, including me, to take a bigger role at the station. He's got that bigger role now, and I'm hoping he'll take advantage of it even at the risk of rubbing Rhyner the wrong way.
I don't feel the Invasion has been better after Mike S's departure. I listen to it far less. I don't know if Sirois has the talent to be a host, I just know I found him entertaining on the Invasion, Cirque and as a fill in. I too have not found him as entertaining on the Freak. I think maybe his best role is the yuck monkey role. I think the Ticket should have put him in the role Davey is currently occupying on the HL and I wonder how long the Davey thing was in the works. Is that part of why Sirois left? All things being equal I wish both he and Julie were still on the Ticket.
ReplyDeleteLike all of us, KDF, you're obviously welcome to your opinion. While you're right in saying a few commenters have said their opinion of Rhyner has changed and that at least one person even questioned if the his role in the station's founding was all it's purported to be. True enough. But in fairness to them, Rhyner has changed a lot since the mid-oughts. Some might think it's for the better, others not so much. The two (personality/founding narrative) aren't related. I agree with you and others who say regardless of The Freak's level of success or lack thereof, it should not lessen what Rhyner accomplished with The Ticket. As for Sirois and Julie and the "Cat knows talent" mantra, I don't take it as saying they shouldn't try; rather, I read it as there's a reason why Cat didn't find them or promise them future host roles, that he has a good eye for what works day in, day out and for the long haul. I have to say that one month in neither of them are shining now they're in the spotlight. So the idea that Cat knows talent and didn't see either of them as host material is thus far panning out. So far neither is anything above mediocre, if that. Unfortunately, it's true. This might very well change. We'll see. So in a nutshell, no, I don't think you're reading too much into certain statements . . . but misreading.
ReplyDeleteAS to Sirois' hosting abilities, I've said it before and will say it one final time:
ReplyDeleteIt's far easier to be "on" and be everyone's favorite uncle or to be weekend dad who gets to play good cop and let's the kids do whatever they want than to have to be "on" every day, to be "on" for the grind, to have to ask Little Mary to do her homework and take a bath for the umpteenth time this week and it's only Wednesday, and to have to say, "no, we do not __" for the gazillionth time this week and it's still only Wednesday. The former was Sirois' role at The Ticket; the latter, at The Freak. BIG differnce. BIGGER responsibilities and MUCH BIGGER expectations.
So, yes, Sirois could be entertaining on CdS. Recall CdS was off more than it was on-air. It was a 2-3 hour Saturday show. Not a 3-4 hour 5 day per week show. NaD is a less than 2 hour show. When your foil is Norm, well, just who doesn't come off as funny and entertaining? (Food dor thought: Norm's decline might've been the thing that made Sirois and even Donnie to some extent more attractive.) Again, it's a less than 2 hour show and he chose his spots. Fill ins are just that, fill ins. My point is, I'm not sure exactly where all these supposed bona fides come from (?). There's more I could say but won't because mostly it's not positive and at this point (or any point, really) frankly it's moot. Forget his Ticket work, he's now a host of a pm drive show and partnered with a genuine radio legend in the 5th largest market in the USA. THIS is the hill he lives or dies on. So let's focus on his present work and not the past. And thus far his work has been underwhelming. Early days, for sure, but everything that seems like it's been around forever once had its early days. Early days are no longer early in fairly short order. One month in. It'll be six in a blink of an eye. I want Sirois to succeed. And I totally agree with KDF (and have said as much) that he's in the wrong role and most likely with the wrong partner. He needs to be on the morning show in a 3rd host/Gordo/Yuck Monkey role. I think there he would be much better set up for success.
As for Julie, I don't relish in saying this as she seems like a nice human, but I believe she's in over her head. Way too much too soon.
One more thing. Listened to the entirety of B&S today. I really wanted to get one last feel for the show. Toward the latter 3rd of the show the reason they've been the hit you'd think they would've been by now is for one thing: neither of them can tell a story. They can't. These guys are childhood buddies who have lived their entire lives in the area. They have been DFW insiders (sports, media, entertainment) for decades now. Their experiences and stories and knowing where bodies are buried knowledge should equate must-hear radio. Yet it doesn't. It boils down to neither of them being compelling communicators. They have gold material in spades and sadly are babbling dingleberries. This in turn engenders the blatantly fake overlaughing that mars every segment. Honestly, I think it's a damn shame. They should be THE show to listen to in this town.
To paraphrase Regina George, DFW radio overlords need to stop trying to make B&S happen. They’ve had the better part of a decade and a half to win a daypart at no fewer than 4 formats/stations. In a prior thread, the Plainsman of the Americans made a remark (with 100% accuracy) in response to a thought on an all female show telling market that the freak isn’t serious about that time slot. I’d go a step further and say any station continuing to give meaningful weekday hours to B&S isn’t serious about winning monthly books or it’s ongoing viability.
ReplyDelete^^^^^^BINGO.
ReplyDeleteWhich, in conjuction with having a 73 year old "I'm back, bitches" senior AARP member as the lynchpin of the station and a talent pool consisting of unknowns outside of an extremely small as in miniscule very niche pocket of social media, all tells you (if you're able to see past your toes) that this format is a place holder. It was given the green light by a now gone PD who knew he was about to exit (voluntarily or otherwise), is friends with some of the players involved, and said "fuck it, let's go, I'm out anyways so it's, ahem, no skin off my back." There is absolutely no buzz whatsover about The Freak. The moment it went live, it died. The only build up was, "Is this really happening? How or better yet why is Mike Rhyner doing this? It doesn't make sense. Who's involved, who will be involved and what was the timeline of its genesis?" That was the hype, other than the bytes spilled on Ticket minded Twitter, reddit, and the handful that inhabit this space (no offense, Plainsman, I truly dig your site/forum). Here's the rub. Those questions that were answered made no dent. The questions left unanswered (which are actually more interesting) made no dent.
The Freak is weak. Doubt me? Look at their reddit page. Look at The Ticket reddit page. Look at The Freak weekly thread vs. The Ticket weekly thread on The Ticket reddit page. Compare the comment numbers from the build up/1st few days of it going live and now. The numbers should be eye-opening to anyone involved with or hedging their bets on The Freak. Still doubt me? Listen to it. Look, I'm not going to bag on any of them personally (the dig at Rhyner's "I'm back, bitches" was more at the person who decided that a senior citizen making that statement was something the new format designed to attract edgy youth should be built around and not Rhyner. All that jazz is Rhyner's burden to bear (another comment in itself). And I'm not going to crap on the others. I don't give a rat's ass about what any of them did prior to their new stint at The Freak. I'm judging them on the here and now. So far, so bad. There's not a single show that says either "I'm great" or "I have potential for greatness." Not a one. Major shakeup by Feb 23. Dead and gone and 97.1 is a rock station again by Sept '23.
There's a lot of thoughtful speculation and conjecture on this blog. One thing, however, that needs to be kept in consideration when it comes to iHeart's committment to The Freak is that they knew what they were stepping into and knew/know it's going to take some time, even a considerable amount of time, to make real inroads. All of which is to say that iHeart believes in the format. That format is, literally, we do/say what we want. The idea pertains to the perceived (real or not) shortening of attenion spans and constant need for variety (i.e., memes), especially in the coveted demo. All of you who think that the inaugural lineup will not be a part of what will eventually be known as the "classic Freak" lineup are correct. Be forewarned, there's a very good chance personalities you have allegiance to might very well not be at The Freak sooner rather than later. Like The Ticket, The Freak too will undergo some major overhauls before it settles into a groove and finds and defines itself with the listening audience. But you can't compare the two stations. Same "founder" but way different circumstances, and in every way possible.
ReplyDeleteIs iHeart’s commitment misplaced? The BEST format for hosts saying what they please are podcasts. So who is buying this ridiculously outdated pitch? Ah yes, terrestrial radio. Plainsman-is it possible you are being too nice about some of the Freak hosts? I think some of them sound like nice people. I don’t agree that they are talented for this medium. Having been in the teaching profession for years (high school and college), lots of nice people….LOTS of poor communicators. Again, lack of professional talent for the thing they are trying to do.
ReplyDeleteIn today’s version of the Invasion…you thought the show was disjointed when Norm broadcasts from home? How about Norm on the freaking phone to start the show because he can’t get the clean feed working this morning? Can someone get this octogenarian to retire already?
ReplyDeleteHe's not in his 80s, therefore he's not an octogenerian. He's three years older than Rhyner. If his presence and performance offends you so much, flip over the The FAN or The Freak for those two hours.
ReplyDeleteNorm is actually 7 years older than Rhyner.
ReplyDeleteSo I wanna throw some positivity out. OK, some but not only.
ReplyDeleteFirst off, Monty is killing it on all levels. He has to be next in line for a serious bump in stature and status. I very much hope that when Norm retires it is Monty that gets a hosting position. Monty, like Jake before him, has earned it and has that special something that sets him apart from the rest. I'll go a step further and say he's better than Jake in that his sports acumen and sense of humor and understanding of what makes The Ticket The Ticket every bit as good as Jake's but he's also more even keeled in demeanor and is far less inclined to wear his socio-political views on his shoulders, which makes him less polarizing, more likeable. I'm really pulling for Ol' Monto.
I also want to say that I agree with the idea that Sirois is talented but has been paired with the wrong partner. If you ever heard he and Cash's interviews on CdS, you'd be hard pressed not to see that the guy has the goods. He just needs to be put in the right position to show them off. I don't think anyone is a good fit for Mike R other than Greggo. But the rub here is that if you listened to his post Ticket pods you'd also be hard pressed to see that he doesn't have much to say of interest. This includes his interviews. If not for Dale Hansen being Dale Hansen (press play and he'll go on forever with crazy story after crazy story), Eric Nadel being Eric Nadel, and so on, there wouldn't have been one episode worth your while. I'm not trying to bag on Mike R. It's been pretty well stated here just how important he was to The Ticket's founding and success and once upon a time he was (it must be said, briefly) a must listen to voice in the DFW area. But for whatever reason he lost interest in his job (it was obvious) and receded into the background and basically went on a 12 year paid vacation, a very well paid vacation at that. My hope is that The Freak pd will shake things up, pair Sirois up with someone more suitable, reconfigure the morning program, and either find Mike R a different partner or make his show something more akin to the old Galloway and Co. instead of the ball of confusion it now is. Lastly while it seems they're dug in on the we say what we want motto (lord that's dumb and played out), I hope they find some genre to center everything on and around. As is, The Freak's message and presentation of it is an abject mess.
Actually, Norm's 78 and Mike's 73. Do the arithmetic.
ReplyDeleteRhyner just turned 72 in August.
ReplyDeleteNope. 73. Go check out his Twitter feed.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDelete159, I you and I are in complete agreement.
ReplyDeleteI've been a Justin Montemayor fan for quite a long time. You've hit on something I've tried to communicate on several occasions, which is that Monty has The Ticket Sound. He (and, I'm coming to think, David Mino too), like the best Ticket hosts, is able to have a conversation on mic that sounds like a normal conversation, not like I'm being talked at by someone who's aware of my presence. Very natural, not a conventional broadcast voice. And likable, and funny, and, as you say, knowledgeable enough about sports to get by on The Ticket.
And also re Sirois. The Confessor who has been instructing us quite eloquently and at length about Sirois's experiential shortcomings seems to me to be not quite getting what all of us Sirois fans are saying. He or she is right that CdS and NaD and other fill-ins is not the same gig as a full-time host, and that the full-time host duties bring with them different requirements. But if you don't promote someone who's shown potential in several host-like roles, the alternative for The Downbeat would be to find someone who has already been a successful full-time host to pair with Rhyner. Who would that be? Poach someone from The Fan? They probably have the same noncompetes as the Ticket hosts, and they're not setting the world on fire to begin with. Cowlishaw? JJT? Also not listener draws. No, Mike S has the goods to host a show and he's a fit with the "Ticket renegade" ethos The Freak is trying to promote. 159 and others have said that he may need a new home or a new role. Sure, could be. Me, I think it could work with Rhyner, but, as I said before, he needs to become more Corby-like, take that puppy over in alliance with that nice young Michael Gruber, and let Rhyner chime in as the spirit moves him.
Some good stuff on these threads, Confessors. You can't get this stuff on Reddit. Wonder if anyone is listening.
Mike’s twitter feed says 1950, which would make him 72. Am I going crazy? How is this so hard to grasp?
ReplyDeleteIf you credit Wikipedia, Rhyner was born in August of 1950. Which would make him 72. When you enter "how old is Mike Rhyner" on Google, you get "about 71 years." I've tried to parse his age from stuff I've heard from time to time, and I would have guessed one of those two numbers, not 73. I don't know what his Twitter feed says. Maybe he is 73, maybe he got held back or something.
ReplyDeleteBut it's not what the calendar says, it's what comes through the microphone. And he sounds fine, and Norm, increasingly, does not, I'm sorry to say.
Rhyner is 72. I know it for a fact because he frequents (hint, plays at) my place of employment. No, I'm not a close friend of his, just a guy that sometimes serves him a tasty adult bev. If Wiki is to be believed Norm is 78. That means there's 6 years between the two. So pretty much everyone has been wrong in some regard. Either they got the age wrong of Rhyner or Norm or the difference in years. Can we now move on and quit having to have the last word?
ReplyDeleteJust to let you all know, Rhyner's a quiet, nice guy and tips appropriately. Usually comes in solo and has always been cool with fans who engage him. Never once seen him act like a puffed up jerk. I hope The Freak works out.
Anyone know when the first ratings book with The Freak comes out?
ReplyDeleteMonday is the monthly, but will only count, I believe, the 1st week of the station's existence.
Deletehttps://www.arbitron.com/home/delivsched.asp
ReplyDeleteThanks for the URL.
ReplyDeleteHave it on pretty damn good word that despite what might appear to many of you as discombobulation, iHeart knows exactly what they're trying to accomplish with The Freak. They are trying to give a satellite/internet radio - podcast feel. Listen to The Freak's local weekend programming. It's mainly the weekday hosts doing shows focused on music and other pet projects. The rule here is there are no rules. iHeart understands that it will take time for a format like this to take hold with listeners who get their content chiefly from terrestrial radio, as they are judged to be reluctant adopters. They also believe not having a central focal point of content is where things are going in general (think streaming services, choose your own content); that attention spans are rapidly shrinking and focusing on any one thing will sooner rather than later lose listeners. If you know anything about the data coming from Tik Tok studies and the music industry you probably understand this already. Is this the near-future? Not sure. But it is what all corporations involved in the entertainment industry are betting on. Heterogeneity is the name of the current game. It's been trending this way for years but we are finally arriving at the put up or shut up/shit or get off the pot moment. In this way The Freak's insistence that it is pathbreaking is not wholly incorrect.
ReplyDeleteSo you go to the steakhouse and get steak. Maybe you’re side is a baked potato. Maybe mashed. You might be a creamed spinach type. But all of those go with your steak. I bet very few people go in and order an array of sides. Lists, games, creamed corn, bits, broccoli, music. They’re all side dishes. People go for the steak. Or the (fill in your favorite cuisine here). Some people love sides. But is a restaurant that is nothing but side dishes a mass appeal restaurant. Or radio station?
ReplyDeletei like steak.
ReplyDeleteHey, Errol,
ReplyDeleteNice name.
Don't doubt your sources, and thanks for passing along their news.
But The Freak has anything but a "satellite/internet radio/podcast" feel. If this is iHeart's aim, it has fatally misfired.
Satellite radio has a bunch of stations, each of which has a narrow focus.
Podcasts each have a particular subject to which it's devoted.
The Freak claims expressly that what IT has is "what we want to talk about." The exact opposite of the targeted content of SixiusXM and podcasts. That just ain't a destination unless your personalities are very compelling AS PERSONALITIES. What the Freak has is one unquestionably appealing radio personality, Mike Rhyner, who's fun to listen to but really has not much to say, a guy who really isn't dialed in to news, popular culture, or The Sosh.
iHeart can say they were doing something revolutionary and just give the revolution a little time to takoe hold, but hell -- Mike Rhyner used to HATE Ben & Skin. Mike Rhyner HATED calls. Mike Rhyner is NOT a fan of female broadcasters. Confessors have said that the thing feels tossed together. It does.
I think The Freak came about by virtue of one helluva sell job by one Mike Sirois to Mike Rhyner that was buttressed by a "you bet we can!" rah rah Ben & Skin -- all based on a small but shouting, never shutting up, ever demanding whatever it is they want in the moment niche sosh community. iHeart bit. iHeart then allowed Rhyner and Sirois with some input from B&S to assemble the on-air talent that would convey the Seinfeld-esque rally cry-mantra of "We say what we want" -- it's a show about nothing. It feels slapped together because it was. And for something of this magnitude, it was slapped together last-minute. Last-minute here meaning Since spring '22. By the way, if you take the time to scroll back through MTC threads you'll find a month and change prior to Sirois' leaving So Anonymous begins sporadically posting messages that read, "anything is possible," "everything is possible," "everything is in play." When JV, including Sirois, Jer, and Danny, left we all thought, "huh, I guess So Anon had the goods again, but seems a bit oversold." Little did we know at that time.
ReplyDeleteThe Freak sounds last-minute because as far as format changes go, it is. It's also populated with talent that, other than one host, is relatively inexperienced, at least where hosting a daily show is concerned. I'm interested in seeing how this all pans out. And even more interested in the aftermath of its panning out, positively or negatively, for both The Freak and its hosts and for The Ticket and how it reacts. Count me in as team "real competition is good for everyone, but especially the listener." So go Freak, go Ticket.
Amendment to above: I know B&S have been daily hosts for a couple of decades and that Cavanaugh was on The FAN for several years. But 4 of the 8 hosts do not. They were on-air support who got air time and/or had p/t weekend shows, which is a different animal entirely. Overall, The Freak has a lot of inexperienced players involved. And this isn't College-Station, it's Dallas-Ft. Worth.
ReplyDeleteAgree with Plainsman. This comes across as B&S talked to Rhyner, and then assembled the rest from spare parts lying around the metroplex. If you’re going for a podcaster feel, why hire fan and Ticket cast offs?
ReplyDeleteGoing to share a piece of news/gossip picked up this weekend. Friends with a person in radio sales. And while they’re hesitant to discuss specific numbers, will answer most questions asked. This persons point is that the Eagle was moderately successful as a rock station. Not ticket successful- they said the ticket is usually one of the top stations in the market. But that the Eagle WAS successful. Said the station has/will shed those listeners in an attempt to go for a piece of the Tickets pie. But that doing really well going after the Ticket and fan audience will get them less money than they had as a rock station. This person predicts a very short leash. That if they don’t kill in the first couple ratings books, iheart will flip. Said social media comments by Rhyner-that he may only be there for a year- is a signal that it is to paraphrase a website, “funny or die” . Success or format flip.
ReplyDeleteSo they played with science and science won?
ReplyDeleteNew post/classy red up.
ReplyDeleteThose of you who've posted the last day or so with good stuff, please feel free to cut and paste on the next thread.