A home for those who love almost everything about The Ticket (1310 AM, 96.7 FM, Dallas-Fort Worth), and who would like to discuss -- respectfully and fondly -- their thoughts on how (and whether) to eliminate the "almost."
Big rumblings by those who know. No format flip. Going balls deep on the OG idea, but actually doing it. Saying what you want will not involve sports other than a cursory mention if a local is on a postseason run or a national scandal. Topical. Edgy. High energy. No half hour on leaf blowers. Some old familiar faces new. Many, actually. Two maybe three remain. Still putting the final touches on it. Look for April or May. Out.
Thanks, 00110011. Here a few passages that struck me as interesting. Interesting in what they explicitly say, what's between the lines, and in that they reveal who they are. In all frankness, I'm surprised that Dan comes off looking best. Blake shows a lack of maturity and understanding of how, well, the world works. Unfortunately, it appears Jake stands shoulder to shoulder with Blake. I'd like to say that he read the piece and winced at that particular quote. But I don't think that was the case, or ever will be.
Can't shake the feeling that another piece will come out within the next year and a half. One that is much shorter. An obit of sorts.
********************************************************************** "Had a couple of things gone a bit differently, though, it’s likely these three guys would still be on The Hang Zone. McDowell said that at the local, station level, his and Kemp’s hopes for extracurricular activities to be allowed under a new contract were more or less agreed upon. It was only the corporate suits in the upper echelons of Cumulus Media that put a stop to that, not anyone at the Ticket specifically."
"While agreeing with Kemp that his friends from the past are still his friends, Jones equated the situation to a breakup of sorts. He thinks The Ticket is “trying to erase anything that Dan and Jake did and pretend that they don’t exist. ... So it’s like watching your ex delete you from their life and ask for all their things back and you wished it had been handled a little better.”
“You don't have to write this down, but I do sometimes think about it,” Kemp said with an impish grin growing more evident. “I sent these guys [former Ticket co-workers] an email the other day about how Dan and I leave, right? Blake leaves a couple months later. Blake’s doing better. Multiple people have now been promoted to host, multiple people are promoted to producer, multiple people are promoted from part-time to [Ticket] Ticker positions. I don't want to say ‘hero’ but if you look around, there are a lot of people who are doing way better because we decided to say ‘Fuck off.’’
"McDowell was a bit more diplomatic, adding quickly, “I feel like we politely told the company ‘I do not agree with what you are offering,” before Kemp interjected with, “Who are you trying to be, Aaron Burr?”
"Even though McDowell, Kemp and Jones, unlike Stella, have yet to get their groove back, none of the three seem worried about it. The answer isn’t relevant, because for them, The Dumb Zone has to succeed, and has to eventually find its groove. There is no Plan B."
“From my perspective, that would allow me to chase my dream of being a girl’s high school basketball play-by-play man,” Jones said. “However, I just don't see a scenario where Dan and Jake fail.” --Blake
Let me add to Blake's quip that during one of the on-air roundtables at Ticketstock, Dan was talked about for an entire segment and in a loving-he's our buddy fashion. But that's Blake for you.
Considering his level of contribution, and clear importance to the podcast - I'm so glad to know that Dan and Jake are giving Blake his deserved equal, one-third cut of all revenue the podcast generates - post overhead, of course.
1. "Probably.' key term. 2. You act as if the guest was necessarily on the show. I invite you to offer your sophistical bulsh elsewhere. Middle school called. It wants its debate team tactics back.
Buff and Gordo kinda are one in the same person. The old atta boy I'm with you ploy......on your own comment. Pretty obvious. Also pretty obvious it's a redditor. That segment has swirled up a firestorm of condemnation, hand wringing, and virtue signalling over on the reddit page. You know, the place where 98% of the commenters claim to abhor all things Ticket but seem to catch every segment, and have an OCD thing with respect to publicly showing their fealty to the last Voice Of A Generation that left The Ticket on their own accord. First it was Sirois, then Julie, then Danny, and finally, Dan and Jake -- their latest idee fixe. Fun stuff.
Rock Me, Gordo kinda didn't "atta boy" me. He/she didn't appreciate my sarcasm. Sarcasm you aparanly just didn't get. My point was that if I want serious death penalty discussion, I'm sure as hell not looking at Dan and Jake. They called their show the dumb zone, for Christ's sake. And knowing the two as I do from listening for years, the show is aptly named. If their goal is to be sports talk/ guy talk/progressive cause talk, good F'ing luck. Neither are smart enough or talented enough to pull that off.
Good news is, I don't have to listen. But if that's your thing, good for you.
If you're for real offering to do 'remotes' at your subs' places for $698, you might not be in it for the long haul.
If after a year and almost 5 months of being on-air and you're still referencing your former place of employment that's a direct competitor, you might not be in it for the long haul.
Second set begins at 11:00 PM sharp. Don't forget to tip the waitstaff and bartenders. And for fuck's sake, don't drink and drive.
The hostile ownership could go to cheap programming across the board and still make out better on a national basis. Buyouts coming for Sturm and Corby et al. A Musers podcast would do very well.
There is how shall we say a definite feeling of unease by everyone and I mean everyone at the Mothership. This particular plutocrat could give one shit about something local/regional, no matter how successful. Local/regional success does not exceed national mediocrity in profits. If this hostile takeover occurs, buckle up. At best you MIGHT have the Invasion and The Sweetspot as your "old school" shows. AM/PM salaries/contracts are eaten, for certain. That's best case scenario. More likely is either an execution en masse with national (cheaper) canned shows as the doo doo replacement, or a format change, or (even more likely) a liquidation of nearly if not all terrestrial radio operations across the country. It's this dude and his board's m.o.. Their m.o. is well established, by the way. He/they also do nothing but make obscene amounts of money by dint of said m.o..
All the radio conglomerates are losing money and have declining revenues.
Cumulus is a sh!tshow, but it is in worse shape than the others only by a measure of degree.
There are many possible futures of KTCK, but the 3 most likely scenarios are: (1) continued success; (2) sold; and (3) gradual decline due to cost-savings measures.
I honestly don’t see #3 as likely because KTCK continues to invest in the drivetime shows at the expense of other dayparts. A strategy that, like it or not, has not hurt KTCK.
The idea that we are going to wake up one day in 6 months & 96.7 will be play all Beatles is a complete fantasy.
The Ticket is consistently one of the top billers in the market in spot revenue. I believe they’ve won the market in total billing in 2 of the last 5 years. And that was before their absolute historic run of ratings in 2023. The idea that Cumulus is going to cut costs by cutting what could be their most profitable station in their most profitable cluster seems odd. Possible? Sure. And monkeys could fly out of all our butts also. It just cracks me up that this fan fiction is presented as fact- that there’s definitely a feeling of unease at the Mothership. While completely ignoring reality. The Ticket is at the top of the market. Not just “their” demo but ALL demos. While the Freak is languishing in the high teens or low 20’s and they’re billing is, if my sources are correct, down 40-50% year over year. I see posts like the doomsayer above and become more convinced that some of these posters are the Kevin Turners and Joe Cucunellis of the world, desperately publishing their “Ticket is dying” fan fic hoping they can wish the Freak to success. C
Again. This has zero to do with rhe health if The Ticket. It is solely about a billionaire corporate raider based in India who cares nothing about "billing" and everything about maximum profit. I ask you to actually read the article on the last thread and look into the person in question. After that, if you still want to cocky sniff, snark, and pat others on the head while shaking your enlightened head.... by all means. But I don't think you will.
Ya C, you usually provide good insight here, but this doesn’t seem like it has anything to do with how the ticket is doing. The sports illustrated takeover is what makes it worrisome. The ticket doing well is like SI’s best writer getting the most clicks. He/she didn’t keep their job, everyone was gone.
C- The topic of conversation has nothing to do with either of your normal talking points: ratings and the Freak failing. I appreciate what you bring as far as the chatter inside the office, however. Have you heard anyone in the Cumulus cluster who’s aware of this hostile takeover attempt? Any inside reaction?
I know a couple of the sales guys up there and they’re aware and think it’s a nothing burger. Sports Illustrated wasn’t making money. Print is dead. Radio may be dying but it’s still making lots of money in certain places. One of the places where you can make money is the top of the ratings. With the poison pill, it’s doubtful the sale would happen, and like any business, profitable divisions are generally safer than revenue drainers. Could I see new owner selling off pieces? Sure but how much will they get for small market sticks? And the big sticks in big markets generate a lot of cash flow. It’s why insurance companies used to be owners, radio kicks out lots of cash flow. Especially when a company doesn’t have tons of debt. Some of the posts above seem to lack any sense of how businesses work. So this guy is going to pay a premium to buy Cumulus to destroy it because that’s what he does? How does that make sense? C
I did read the article but maybe there is another article out there that says the exact opposite based on everything I see being posted here.
A corporate raider bought 10% of Cumulus publicly traded stock. The Cumulus Board executed a plan, which all but guarantees this guy can’t acquire 15% of the total company, which really means he has to actually deal with the Cumulus board if he wants to buy Cumulus & it sounds like they are not receptive.
As for SI, the Sports Illustrated most of us grew up with disappeared in 2018. The thing that replaced it has largely been irrelevant since that time. Out of curiosity, I went to SI.com (first time in forever) & they are still posting new articles so I am not sure what is up except to say the understanding that it ceased to exist a week ago seems to be inaccurate.
Last time, then all you of the smart set can have at it. Spend 15 minutes reading up on Manoj Bhargava and his Renew Group. They have a well established method/approach. C, et alia are looking at this from a commonsense business perspective. That is not what Renew trades in. They desire debt. And if debt is tied to a slow dying modality, all the better. Mr. Bhargava has no interest in a product (whatever it is). It's about purchasing debt to both offset other debts and holdings, as well as eventually be sold off at a large profit. If that means liquifying something that is profitable for future, larger profits, so be it. The Ticket per se is profitable (though not as much as some of you think), Cumulus is not. Global finance is not corporate media. Like I said, we ought to hope very much that this hostile takeover is avoided. While it doesn't necessarily mean The End or something damn close, it will in all likelihood mean changes that no one, from the station to the listener to advertisers will be onboard with.
I'm done. Fingers and toes crossed, this does not occur.
Ok, explain this to me like I'm stupid. But I'm reading your word salad. They buy debt to offset other debt? Can anyone explain how that is accounted for on a companies ledger? I owe a billion dollars and I'm going to buy another billion dollars in debt to "offset" the first billion, so instead of 2 billion I owe less? I've read a few things about this guy. But basic business principles still apply.
No. I'm not being paid to educate you. You were woefully wrong about Dan and Jake and their case, you are even more so here. If tou find my words ponderous, then you have no understanding of global finance. Go f yourself and make a sale.
@00110011 Not to negate any good that comes from these philanthropical ventures, but such deeds are in essence tax shelters. They must be done, and on a large scale.
OK. So I did read up on Renew and Manoj Bhargava. From what I can tell, yes he buys up media groups who've fallen into debt or even bankruptcy. He also is quite the philanthropist. I'm not sure if this woudn't be a good thing for The Ticket. Most every article I read paints a picture of a global business giant with an even bigger heart. From what I can tell he turns faltering ventures back into money makers. I'm in no way business savvy and haven't a clue about global finance, but from what I can tell, there seems to be a lot more positive than negative on this front. My two cents.
"If tou find my words ponderous, then you have no understanding of global finance." This line gave me a good laugh, thanks for that. I can just picture the scene in my head as someone storms away. The only thing missing was the "Good day to you sir." Who ever thought we'd see the day where such a phrase would be used, much less as a sick burn, on a blog about the Ticket. Strange days, indeed.
Glad you got a chuckle out of it, KDF. Too bad you missed the contrary, retrograde motion of "Go F yourself and make a sale." Maybe next time, little buddy.
What was there to miss in that comment? It was rude, unduly hostile and not worth commenting on. I gave it all the attention it deserved, which was none. Manners Maketh Man.
Listening to the Dumbzone Lawyers roundtable. 1) Susquehanna was unethical in their treatment of the case 2) Susquehanna employees e.g. Dan Bennett lied in court 3) Susquehanna attorneys were unethical buffoons in their strategy. 4) Cumulus management used intimidation techniques. 5) One of the TDZ lawyers quipped that Cumulus station employees have Stockholm syndrome. Good stuff
6) So says legal team representing clients in a case vs Susquehanna.
Look, they MIGHT be correct on all accounts, but come on. All Astros fans are enablers if cheaters, says the Rangers fan.
I take it there is no clause in the settlement prohibiting disparaging the other party. Because if such a clause is in effect, a can of worms might've been opened.
Frankly, I fail to understand why TDZ even did this. Move on. Stop living in a past you chose to leave behind. Their sub numbers are solid and golding steady, which is great. Focus on YOUR career and stop affording these lawyers a fresh five minutes of fame every few months. Because believe me, this is driven by their legal team. And a few if them are rather thirsty.
Hoping this will be the lend of it. Also hoping another court case isn't on the horizon.
They’re doing this because the audience wants to hear it. People find this interesting. I understand folks whose wildly incorrect predictions about how the lawsuit would go never want to hear about it again, but this is the most public and documented breakup in Ticket history. It’s entertaining.
@DZ OG poster here. I'm a DZ sub. Therefore please stop thinking for me and other subs who also feel the same way about the lawyer/Ticket stuff. Your comment is also a non sequitur. Do you know what that means? It's a logical fallacy. A basic one, at that. It does not follow that criticism of TDZ entails any sort of prediction about their now settled case. While I'm digging most of what Dan and Jake are putting out, some of it does not interest me. Some of it is even annoying (like this latest lawyer/Ticket episode). By the way, I feel the same about Ticket content. So, again, please stop thinking and speaking for others who also share your affinity for TDZ. It's OK to criticize them. You can both critique and enjoy them (or anything) at the same time. Dan and Jake have a good thing going and I'm proud to be a part of it. But it doesn't mean it's perfect. Moreover, I'd hate to see them screw things up because awipe lawyers who love air time and exposure are unable to keep from shit talking. I very much hope there is no non-disparagement clause in the settlement. If such a clause exists, they might've royally fucked up here. Fingers crossed they haven't.
As one of those saying D&J were going to lose, I will say a couple of things. First, Cumulus handled the case extremely poorly. They took too long to act, which suggests there was no emergency or harm. They filed in federal court, which made the standard for getting a TRO & injunction higher. I don’t know why they did these things; there may have been reasons for doing so.
Second, I was always of the opinion the juice wasn’t worth the squeeze. Noncompetes in radio are very common. It’s 6 months. Just do what everyone else in the industry does just deal with it. I also assumed they had an actual plan to do something more than a podcast.
They won. I guess they struck a blow against the man. I dunno if it stops Cumulus or anyone else from trying to enforce a noncompete in the future.
> "I also assumed they had an actual plan to do something more than a podcast.
They hope/want to establish a sort of media network à la Barstool, one that features a few different topic-driven podcasts. While I personally don't see D&J heading up their own, I do think it's plausible that they'll eventually sign a contract with an existing podcast network.
I’ll say one more thing about the Dumb Zone- If they are still doing Patreon in 6 months hovering around 5600 to 5700 paid subscribers, maybe they will be happy with that, but I’ll find that disappointing from 2 guys that were #1 in middays in a top 5 market.
if we're just rounding up to $500K in subscription revenue, and dividing that evenly between the three of them (Dan, Jake and Blake) that's $166K (gross) - probably less than Dan was making, a bit more than Jake and a LOT more than Blake - and generating that while also doing fewer shows, more scheduling flexibility and free reign on content - that feels like a pretty good life!
After six months plus, my experience tells me they've platued, while operating in this mode. To go to the next level is going to require some sort of new exposure from a top tier outlet, or a significant media spend on their part, and either way - a big dob of luck. Because I'm not a sub, and only see what they're doing from the outside, I honestly can't tell you if the content is capable of that next level. Based on the small amout of the free stuff I've listened to/watched... Maybe? Probably not in a direct subscription form.
They're currently making some choices, I suspect, are intended to attract subscribers - but history tells us actually discourages subscribing. They're making novice decisions on how to go about this, 100% understandable, but also shows they have no real expertise in the podcasting space driving this thing. (no, I won't go into specifics because that is what people get paid to do)
The fact they've been able to generate $500K in annual revenue, doing it this way, is a tesitmate to them. 99% of any other podcast would have been lucky to do 10% of what they've pulled. Good dudes, made a tough decision to bet on themselves and while I think they made the wrong decision - I admire them for going for it - I can't think of any radio people who found themselves in the spot they were, would have done the same thing.
$6.90 * 12 * 5700 = $471,960. Less 10.5% for Patreon is still giving ~ $420k gross profit to operate the business and fund salaries. I don't think they're disappointed.
Well, Dan and Jake might've "won," but if you listened to the lawyer episode, then you also heard Dan admit they owe their Legal Dream Team (patent pending) fees that go into the high six figures. No one worked pro bono. No one is getting a discount. High six figures is serious money owed. No puppet (puppet?).
@Window Licker You're leaving out A LOT of expenses, which is tantamount to Michael Scott thinking meets a Ryan Howard (mis)understanding of basic economics even though money and time were spent on business school.
Yes, gross profit, as in "Revenue less COGS." Where COGS are those things that vary directly with revenue. They don't have to buy new microphones every time they add a new listener.
(And, yes, I am also aware that microphones are asset purchases, not expenses, but when someone gets mad without knowing "gross profit" vs "net profit" I'm not going to get into the different financial statements with him/her, and said "microphones" for the absurdity effect)
Do some of you need a hug? Do you need a cookie? Maybe a switch to decaf? Why the level of hostility and rudeness over a radio show and station? Have a piece of pizza and chill out.
I still think Cumulus had Jake dead to rights on his non compete since his clearly mentioned podcasting. I thought the interesting comment from part 1 was lawyer Liz saying she was the “hold on, worst case scenario” voice in the room. That while Matt and Phil were optimistic, Liz had to remind them they could also lose. Which is why I think they ultimately settled. I think the general consensus is that TDZ won. But I think Cumulus got something out this also. They sued talent that tried to break a non compete. That’s got to be unnerving for smaller market jocks that didn’t earn Dan McDowell money. They kept them from going to a competitor, either the Fan or the Freak. And while I don’t remember the exact timeline, by the time they settled, wasn’t there at least one full book of the new line up? If I remember, Invasion and sweet spot did decently, where it wasn’t a total ratings collapse. I think that told Cumulus that loosing TDZ wasn’t going to be that painful. C
I felt confident about it for a while. Who walks away from a dream job in radio without a thought out plan of your next step? Well, it ends up that Dan and Jake do. I checked today, they’re at about 5600 subs. Rough math, 5000x7 is 35k a month, 420k a year. 10% to Patreon, double the producers old probable salary (40) to 80k and it’s 300k to split between Dan and Jake. They don’t have to deal with bosses, can set their own hours, take off when they want, etc. I thought for damn sure they’d be back on radio when the non compete ended, but now? We don’t see them back on the air unless the sub numbers crater and they’re desperate to reestablish themselves. Which may not happen. I gotta think McDowell has to be approaching 60. He’s CB probably thinking if he can ride this podcast for another 5 years he can retire if he wants. C
While C Minus was wrong—consistently, so consistently—it doesn’t mean it was a good decision for them to make as it cost over 100k. C Minus, you were wrong, don’t backpedal to the Cumulus approach being wrong, they wouldn’t have done it that way if they didn’t think it was the way to go. Reading opinions about the NLRB & non competes along with Breunig’s commentary puts it into better perspective. I think a lot of people were more disappointed in the Plainsman erring so wrongly on this. Maybe need to be more impartial in the future when you admittedly weren’t well versed in this type of law. A real letdown more than C Minus having to swallow defeat.
Dan's 55. You need to factor in equipment, paying Rob Chickering, insurance for Dan, Jake, and Blake, etc., etc. The equipment/maintenance factor is a lot more expensive than you'd think. Especially if you're going to put on a top quality pod. More so if you're going to stream and do it professionally. Still, at this sub number it's more than doable and leaves enough left for healthy salaries. But. As C and others have pointed out: this is all contingent on sub numbers constantly remaining where they are, as the groundfloor. That's tough. At least it is in the long run. It also means a lot of hard work on their part. Hard, hustling work that never ends -- day/week/year after day/week/year. Maybe they have that in them. Maybe not. I wish them nothing but the best. It's always exciting to watch those who have the sack to just go for it. As someone else said, now that they had an entire show pulling the curtain back about their exit from The Ticket, I do hope they put it behind them and turn their entire focus on the product. Their future depends on it. Go Dan and Jake. Go Ticket, too.
On another note: There is a genuine more than a whisper going around that iHeart is discussing a change for 97.1. I've heard two avenues being tossed around. 1. A complete re-tooling with all new talent, including more or mostly syndicated shows. 2. A format change to Pride. It's what you might think it is. An LGBTQ and adjacent issues/lifestyle format. Take none of this as hold onto your butts stuff. I'm just passing along what I'm hearing.
Add in also FICA/SSN taken out monthly for any employee plus sundry taxes that come along with running a business. And then there's dealing with all that and keeping up with/doing the proverbial books. If that's not your bag, then you also have to hire a CPA. On the whole, CPA fees for business are more costly than for individuals. Then there's selling yourself in order to generate sponsorship. Right now, that might come in the form of Ticket and/or Ticket adjancent sponsors who support TDZ. That won't be enough for the longer game. That takes a lot of time and energy. All of the above takes a lot of time and energy if you go the DIY route. The sort of time and energy that saps the creative life out of most. So now toss in a PR person/firm to the oost of operations. While you're at it, you're going to need far more often than you probably anticipate a tech specialist. They aren't cheap.
All of which is to say, there's much on the dudes' plate. Godspeed to them.
I would think a Pride format would go over like a dead balloon. I was looking at the format & I don’t see selling to any local advertisers. (Insert Subaru dealer joke here). Not that there isn’t a sizeable LGBTQ+ population here, it just seems too niche for even that market. Obviously, I can be wrong, but I will note heart doesn’t seem to sold on the format since they put these on network on the HD2 feeds.
My memory is that network talk doesn’t do well in DFW outside the big conservative names. It would, at least be cheaper. But a sad give up for a once great frequency
tdz will not be on the freak. the freak will not be the freak by the end of this calendar year
neither will tdz be tdz by the end of the '25 calendar year
dan will be in birmingham, alabama manning matt 'i like 'em young' mcclarin's old spot
jake will be out of the game altogether rocking hard on his family's business and getting his rocks off with ijb and going all in on the local political scene with tc
you already know cumulus' legal team and strats are a joke
you'll also come to know that the whole stockholm syndrome thing was actually the legal dream team holding dan and jake hostage
lol on the lawyers holding them hostage. Tilt your head and look at it from a slightly different angle. They paid their lawyers a huge amount to be able to start their podcast in August rather than waiting 6 months. Go listen to Dan on a Cleveland podcast that's linked on their Reddit page. He says what cumulus got out of it was the intimidation factor for others. Also slips and says “70 thou, I don’t even know how much in legal fees, and most of our lawyers were working for free”. Was it worth. 70k to start the podcast right away ? I’ll repeat, I think Cumulus was ready to settle because they’d made their point- “we will sue you over a non compete.” And they let them do the podcast because by the time they were in court, the August book had come out and shown that THZ was replaceable. C
Wrong. Tilt your head and look at it from an angle that doesn't affix itself to your bizarre cult like attraction to a doucher rich boy frat boy who was a part of a sex cult in high school who is easily afforded progressive views due to both his family's and his wife's family' wealth and has no real world consequences vis a vis his kick ass ass kicking modus operandi and a wannabe comic who both offers nothing but a parrot of others' standup acts in conjunction with the aforementioned sadness the other trades in that in conjunction comports to their both particular psycho-sociological dispositions.
By the by. You have no idea how the real world works. Good luck with your bottom on that one.
Baby, if you ever wondered. Wondered, whatever became of me.
OK OK OK. my babies. I thought the juice was ripe and ready to hydrate yo and self tuckus, ya know, to vitalize. But babies, I was premature like a crack a lack newborn. No no no, my wang dang don't need no blue or red or green pill sweet poon, nah ain't going there theater of the mind. That's all good. I'm talking about what I knew. What I know. To. Be. Real. Yo. Is absolutely most Toni Braxtonly real. Andy Travis is back, babies. So too is Dr. Johnny Fever. You know he has a Phd in Rock? You better you bet you mother scratchers. But here' the nipple tickler. My man Venus is back on the scene (as if he ever left, right?!, yo!). He be the candyman. the Wiz, the PFunk. Dig? You, I like.
(1) From the outset, this site questioned Cumulus's legal strategy and identified several very questionable moves (and sloppy pleading). Its inexplicable delays, including failure to go for a temporary restraining order immediately, where it could have gotten some preliminary relief without much proof of injury -- or any, there being authority for injury being presumed in such cases -- were the most serious, but not the only, errors that I and others identified.
I also agree with one of the comments above that filing this in federal rather than state court was a major error, as was initial reliance on Atlanta counsel.
In addition, it seemed clear from the hearing that was eventually held that Cumulus witnesses were not prepared, and that little effort had been made to satisfy the elements for injunctive relief. (Injunctive relief = a court telling someone they can't do something, rather than awarding damages.)
Handled properly, at the outset it looked like a fair-to-good case for Cumulus, but in the event, it devolved into a desultorily-prosecuted case its lawyers are not going to want on their resumes. Several of the lawyer Confessors and I did look on in wonderment as Cumulus frittered away its early technical advantages in a case where it should have done much better.
And, as a wise man once said, you never know what the ball gonna do.
(2) Result: Victory for Dan and Jake on the injunctive portion of the case, despite their violation of the terms of the noncompete. (The court did not find they did not violate their noncompete -- that wasn't what the hearing was about.) It was a deserved victory that owed a lot to Cumulus's bungling and outright laziness, but also to their own lawyers' pugnacity and energy.
(3) Second result: Victory for Dan and Jake in settling the case favorably thereafter. But the reason there had to be a settlement was that the victory on the injunction hearing did not end the case against them. The violation was still out there, and if Cumulus had chosen to proceed it could (with actual proof and evidence this time around, if there was any to be had) have sought money damages from the lads. Instead, it folded its tents and Jake and Dan were also off the hook for damages. So: Dan and Jake victory.
(4) But a lot of the ink spilled on this case had to do with their lawyers' claims, urged both in the lawsuit and in the NLRB filing, that the noncompetes were illegal, which, if correct, would have ended the entire case against them (at least on the noncompete -- the trademark stuff didn't seem to excite anyone). The judge did not rule on that, but she hinted in open court that if the case had continued, Dan and Jake would have lost on that one, at least in her court. They could still be required to defend the damages case.
(5) I don't know what happened to the NLRB complaints, but if the settlement did not require their voluntary withdrawal (which is permitted under NLRB rules, although the NLRB can decline to permit withdrawal), that would be another jaw-dropping error by Cumulus. I tried (not very hard) to track down what happened to the complaints, failed. I believe one of their attorneys filed some kind of NLRB petition on his own behalf challenging noncompetes, but don't know what happened to that, either -- however, it does suggest that perhaps the Kemp/McDowell complaints were dismissed. If anyone knows how to track down what happened to those complaints, I'd be very interested.
(6) Where does that leave us? Victory for Jake and Dan despite thumbing their noses at the noncompetes. A gamble that paid off, but make no mistake -- it was a gamble. With better decisions and more elbow grease by the Cumulus team (and, by the way -- it's unclear whether all the errors were solely on the lawyers [some clearly were], or whether Cumulus reined them in for some reason), things could have ended badly for them.
Did Cumulus get any benefit at all out of this? Hard to see it, unless they stiffed their lawyers.
(7) Congratulations to Dan and Jake. I hope they thrive. The cash flow isn't gigantic, yet, but it's pretty good. I wonder, though, if they feel kind of lonely sometimes.
Matt Bruenig discusses the NLRB complaints on his March 3 podcast (The Bruenigs, on patreon). Basically, part of the settlement agreement required Bruenig to submit a withdrawal request, which he did. The NLRB has thus far declined to permit withdrawl of the charges. Soon after the withdrawal request, the NLRB regional director got the attorneys for both sides on a zoom call, and requested that the attorneys review the law and told them to review the law and submit a statement as to whether the felt Cumulus' actions were illegal. This put Bruenig in a bind because while in his opinion, the charges were valid, and what Cumulus was doing was illegal, to put that in writing after the settlement was already agreed to would certainly tick of Cumulus, but he didn't want to lie to the NLRB. So, he played it straight, sent a letter saying in his opinion what Cumulus was doing was illegal. This did piss Cumulus off and they threatened to go back to the judge. However, this kind of threat is also apparently a violation of the NLRA, so Bruenig sent them the applicable portion of the law, and demanded they retract their threat, or he would bring another charge against them to the NLRB. Cumulus backed off and retracted their threat.
Nothing further has come from the NLRB as of this moment, the charges have not been withdrawn or moved forward, they are just sitting at the NLRB. Bruenig is surprised it is taking this long for something to happen. Bruenig has also separately filed charges himself against cumulus based on a bunch (17? or so) violations of the NLRB in their employee handbook. If the NLRB moves forward with the charges, both cases will be combined. I recommend subscribing to Bruenigs podcast, at least for a month to listen to this one podcast, it is a lot of good information.
Man, I'd love to see that settlement agreement. I'm not a labor lawyer but even I knew that the NLRB could decline to allow a complainant to withdraw charges, which, under the current political slant of the NLRB on noncompetes, should have been seen as something that could occur and potentially rob Cumulus of a major benefit of the settlement. In that case, the settlement agreement should have provided that as a trigger to allow Cumulus to void the settlement or provide it with some other remedy.
I concede that second-guessing is kind of a coward's game (and anonymous second-guessing even worse), but there is so much that went on in this case that was, and remains, puzzling.
not that anyone cares, but Bruenig and Kingston somehow come off like even bigger assholes on the podcast than they are in real life - which is impressive.
every time I've ever listened to, or read something from, Matt Bruenig - I have a sense he's a guy on some sort of personal legal crusade and his client is mearly a means to an end. I do not find him compelling or convincing. Just a guy who's got a goal and is going to force the result he wants - collatoral damages be damned.
And while I've not heard these newest podcasts, everything shared here just confirms what I assume the content to be.
Legit question: Has Bruenig accomplished any legal result of note? He very well may have, I just am not aware and wouldn't even know where to find that out.
Plainsman- listen to lawyer episode 1 or Dan on the Cleveland podcast. Both flat out say part of the Cumulus goal was to intimidate other jocks in other markets. Probably worth a little $$ every now and then to the company, and it probably cost them less than TDZ if they used in house legal team, or company they have on retainer to handle stuff like this. Bet there’s a negotiated rate instead of lawyer MSRP. And I went back and looked. Mid July to mid August ratings came out Sept 5th. There wasn’t a significant drop. The settlement was released the end of September and ratings came out that first week of October. I think Cumulus got what it really wanted, continued ratings success. C
Yes I’m sure Cumulus would really want to go to trial and have their on air talent make them look even scummier. I’m pretty sure Bob will not lie under oath. Having said that Cat made cumulus look bad enough on his own.
Reread the Wash Post article. Brunieg is a crusader, TDZ lawsuit was going to be explosive, get rid of non competes for thousands of workers nationwide. And…it fizzled. Why did it settle? Had TDZ reached out to the Fan of the Freak in violation of their exclusive negotiating rights period? Did Cumulus really have something in the claim that TDZ were contacting advertisers? Or did TDZ settle because as their lawyer Liz kept reminding them, they could lose this. IMHO they bluffed their way to getting what they really wanted, the podcast. They folded when it came to standing up for the other little guys with non competes. C
Just for the record, the NLRB case continues, so that angle isn’t dead yet. And now that it has been set in motion there is nothing D&J, Bruenig, or Cumulus can do to stop it. And by the way, Cumulus are the one’s that sued D&J so they weren’t crusading for anything to start with, unless you want to argue that D&J baited them into the lawsuit, in which case they are either geniuses for being able to forecast had badly Cumulus would f the case up, or they were just reckless.
I’ll add this- I think locally Bennett and Catlin would have been fat dumb and happy to extend THZ contract. But Dan Mcd made it clear their conflicts were with Cumulus corporate. They were the ones driving the no outside podcast revenue bus. I think Bennett would have been fine with THZ return. But when agreement couldn’t be reached, they were fine with hiring Matt, repositioning Mino, Bass et al as long as ratings held up. Ultimately they want ratings because ratings generally equal revenue. C
It is apparent that Cumulus does not understand that The Ticket is different than all of their other typical radio stations. Think about trying to explain to someone at corporate that they need to pay a couple of midday hosts probably $500k or possibly more in combined salary when you can plug in a couple of spares for probably less than $150k combined and not really lose ratings. And they are probably right, in the short term anyway. But long term I think they will suffer. After the Musers and Corby retire the station is probably done, or at least they will sink to at or below the level of the FAN. Say what you will about Jake but he was the only one out of all the people in the farm system that had the talent to carry a drive time show (maybe Monty but he can’t even get a host gig).
While I don't exactly disagree with the premise of your statement, The Ticket has been pronounced dead about a dozen times based on the departure of someone for over 15 years now and they continue to thrive. I think it's time to quit thinking that the next departure is the one to sink them.
C-, They were asked to take a pay cut and in lieu of that wanted to be able to create other revenue streams. I think what you’re trying to say is that Cat and DB were ok with that but corporate wasn’t which you might be right. I am in agreeance with you that this all could have been avoided by waiting out the non compete. I’m in disagreeance that they ultimately would have lost the case. The judge was intimating to Cumulus that settlement was the best course of action as she wasn’t going to push against the 1st amendment which would have cascaded to the non compete.
I think Cat and DB helped Cumulus see which way the wind was blowing and the long term damage of PK subpoena-ing guys like Bob, Corby, Gordo, etc. PK has made no qualms that he was willing to do what it would take to win the case I just don’t think Cumulus and even Dan & Jake had the stomach for it. He could bring in past and present employees including Rhyner to highlight hostile environment allegations. While I would have liked to have seen that all play out, ultimately D&J wanted to podcast and not burn down a station that their friends work at.
I think as the years go by, you realize “friends “ you no longer work with are more like acquaintances as it is rare you ever spend any significant time with them again. Highly doubtful in the 8 months since they’ve left KTCK that they’ve spent in person time with their “friends “.
Dan and Jake have said repeatedly that their quarrel was not about the money. They were satisfied with the salary portion of the contract offer from Cumulus. It was just the “other ventures” that they differed over, which eventually led to the split.
The only folks who like The Freq are folks who never listened to The Ticket. People who had 97.1 already on their preset. Half of them or so tuned out.
Anecdotally disagree, Poor the Legend. I’ve been a hardcore tickethead for 20 years and still listen to the Musers more than anything else. I’m not a freakhead, but I enjoy the downbeat podcast quite a bit.
So this and all the WKRP crap (it's obviously the same person) is some sort of Andy Kaufmannesque gag, right? Has to be. If so, in a weird way I almost look forward to each of of these insane, surreal, word salad absurdist attempts at getting an agenda of sorts across. It seems to me that if there is a purpose to this madness, it's either to annoy those the author finds her/himself annoying, or, merely to stir the pot and watch shit fly. Whatever the case, you sir or madam need counseling and in all likelihood meds.
However moronically put, Gettin' My Krafty On is actually correct in saying that TDB had a meeting with management this week. In fact, I've been told all shows met with management. What was said and how it went, I've no idea. From a few hints found on reddit/freak and on X, it does seem that something's up. When you have on-air talent saying things like, for example (paraphrasing here): "Given the current climate, I don't think talking about anything radio business or management related is a good idea," it's safe to say management-employee discussions are being had. As such it isn't unfair to read between the lines and come to the conclusion that either change is coming and/or if numbers don't change, change is coming.
Go back to reddit where you belong, Regonk. Your piss poor attempt at snark fell flat. The pee drinkers on reddit will be far more appreciative, receptive of your weak attempt.
Well, Jimmy, if there were a lot and I mean A LOT more like you out there, it probably would. But there isn't and there's no calvary charging hard with aim to save the day. There's also the stubborn fact that excepting the very few, such as yourself, listeners fail to find any show even somewhat interesting. Don't get me wrong, I really wanted a genuine alternative listening option. One that would foster healthy competition and force the top dog to give it their best. It would've been a win-win all around for everyone. That's not what happened. Glad you like what they offer. Again, you are the exception. So enjoy it while you can, as it's not long for the radioscape. Maybe Danny and Sirois will continue on in pod or stream form? There might be something in that.
is it? it didn't for THZ when it came out the gates slow and everyone was dogpiling on the PD for pairing Jake with Dan in the first place.
That really is the most comedic aspect of all this newly formed division - I'd kill to see a Venn Diagram of TDZ Champions and "P1's who told Cat he was a f'ing idiot for pairing D&J together".
Exactly, Knob. Don't let hard facts get in the way of The Narrative. Check out reddit/ticket. The idiots are excoriating Peter for having the temerity to post the ratings and explain them and historically situate the data.It's flat out fucking nuts. Meanwhile, over at reddit/thedumbzone the pee drinkers are actively tryimg to ban a commenter who dare deigns to opine there may be another side to legal proceedings. It's a little bit frightening to watch the mob gather. #TheCultIsReal
Like the company you keep, your audience is often a reflection of you. There is something about Dan and Jake that seems to attract the nasty, the ill-informed, and those who readily conform to the will of the crowd. Which, of course, is ironic when you consider how progressive and against the grain both these folks and their dear leaders hold themselves to be.
Ya, I think you’re onto something. Before the departure or anything, the hangzone fan boys were completely ridiculous. People on Reddit would post how they’re the best show randomly when the show wasn’t even on. And this is for a show that in its grand scheme of things, was in its infancy. The musers undoubtedly had more fan boys, but they didn’t seem as swifty about it.
my pleasure - yesterday was pretty entertaining. I generally don't engage in the comments to those posts, but I tried to answer questions that I thought came from a place of good faith or in one instance something that was just outright inaccurate (That I am 'forced' or paid to post them) because it appeared to be people who'd never seen it before.
What took place on reddit was an embarrassment. That page is beyond toxic and has a collective IQ that makes a green mollusk look positively brilliant.
Nothing much new to report. Just trying to keep the threads to a manageable length.
ReplyDeleteBig rumblings by those who know. No format flip. Going balls deep on the OG idea, but actually doing it. Saying what you want will not involve sports other than a cursory mention if a local is on a postseason run or a national scandal. Topical. Edgy. High energy. No half hour on leaf blowers. Some old familiar faces new. Many, actually. Two maybe three remain. Still putting the final touches on it. Look for April or May. Out.
ReplyDeleteInteresting pivot from your home of the Mavs
DeleteNothing edgier than 50 and 80 year olds ranking beans and doing fart drops
ReplyDeletewas there a second bean ranking or did that just happen the once?
DeleteThe Dallas Observer did a piece on TDZ.
ReplyDeletehttps://www.dallasobserver.com/arts/since-leaving-dallas-the-ticket-the-dumb-zone-still-seeks-its-groove-18730385
Thanks, 00110011. Here a few passages that struck me as interesting. Interesting in what they explicitly say, what's between the lines, and in that they reveal who they are. In all frankness, I'm surprised that Dan comes off looking best. Blake shows a lack of maturity and understanding of how, well, the world works. Unfortunately, it appears Jake stands shoulder to shoulder with Blake. I'd like to say that he read the piece and winced at that particular quote. But I don't think that was the case, or ever will be.
ReplyDeleteCan't shake the feeling that another piece will come out within the next year and a half. One that is much shorter. An obit of sorts.
**********************************************************************
"Had a couple of things gone a bit differently, though, it’s likely these three guys would still be on The Hang Zone. McDowell said that at the local, station level, his and Kemp’s hopes for extracurricular activities to be allowed under a new contract were more or less agreed upon. It was only the corporate suits in the upper echelons of Cumulus Media that put a stop to that, not anyone at the Ticket specifically."
"While agreeing with Kemp that his friends from the past are still his friends, Jones equated the situation to a breakup of sorts. He thinks The Ticket is “trying to erase anything that Dan and Jake did and pretend that they don’t exist. ... So it’s like watching your ex delete you from their life and ask for all their things back and you wished it had been handled a little better.”
“You don't have to write this down, but I do sometimes think about it,” Kemp said with an impish grin growing more evident. “I sent these guys [former Ticket co-workers] an email the other day about how Dan and I leave, right? Blake leaves a couple months later. Blake’s doing better. Multiple people have now been promoted to host, multiple people are promoted to producer, multiple people are promoted from part-time to [Ticket] Ticker positions. I don't want to say ‘hero’ but if you look around, there are a lot of people who are doing way better because we decided to say ‘Fuck off.’’
"McDowell was a bit more diplomatic, adding quickly, “I feel like we politely told the company ‘I do not agree with what you are offering,” before Kemp interjected with, “Who are you trying to be, Aaron Burr?”
"Even though McDowell, Kemp and Jones, unlike Stella, have yet to get their groove back, none of the three seem worried about it. The answer isn’t relevant, because for them, The Dumb Zone has to succeed, and has to eventually find its groove. There is no Plan B."
“From my perspective, that would allow me to chase my dream of being a girl’s high school basketball play-by-play man,” Jones said. “However, I just don't see a scenario where Dan and Jake fail.” --Blake
And Jake was doing way better because Rhyner said Fuck Off. What’s his point?
DeleteLet me add to Blake's quip that during one of the on-air roundtables at Ticketstock, Dan was talked about for an entire segment and in a loving-he's our buddy fashion. But that's Blake for you.
ReplyDeleteConsidering his level of contribution, and clear importance to the podcast - I'm so glad to know that Dan and Jake are giving Blake his deserved equal, one-third cut of all revenue the podcast generates - post overhead, of course.
ReplyDeleteBut is he being paid a Living Wage? Is he getting health insurance? Does he have paid vacation days? TELL US. NO. YOU. RADIO KNOW. YOU. TELL US.
ReplyDeleteDon’t get distracted. Are the Musers around? In the Hardline?
ReplyDeleteNobody cares about the Dumb Zone.
If you do, and you think that that matters to KTCK, maybe think again.
Also: to the guy who called me a 5 head (Sirois, or one of his Wernicke pals), you’re still losing. And you will always lose. Who. Are. Ya.
ReplyDeleteBruh. 5 head is a compliment. Gamer slang for 5 steps ahead of everyone else. Chill, dude.
DeleteDeath penalty talk with their lawyer's wife??? Riveting!
ReplyDeleteYou're right, instead they should spend the morning making fun of the probably innocent man's last words on death row
Delete1. "Probably.' key term. 2. You act as if the guest was necessarily on the show. I invite you to offer your sophistical bulsh elsewhere. Middle school called. It wants its debate team tactics back.
DeleteBuff and Gordo kinda are one in the same person. The old atta boy I'm with you ploy......on your own comment. Pretty obvious. Also pretty obvious it's a redditor. That segment has swirled up a firestorm of condemnation, hand wringing, and virtue signalling over on the reddit page. You know, the place where 98% of the commenters claim to abhor all things Ticket but seem to catch every segment, and have an OCD thing with respect to publicly showing their fealty to the last Voice Of A Generation that left The Ticket on their own accord. First it was Sirois, then Julie, then Danny, and finally, Dan and Jake -- their latest idee fixe. Fun stuff.
ReplyDeleteRock Me, Gordo kinda didn't "atta boy" me. He/she didn't appreciate my sarcasm. Sarcasm you aparanly just didn't get. My point was that if I want serious death penalty discussion, I'm sure as hell not looking at Dan and Jake. They called their show the dumb zone, for Christ's sake. And knowing the two as I do from listening for years, the show is aptly named. If their goal is to be sports talk/ guy talk/progressive cause talk, good F'ing luck. Neither are smart enough or talented enough to pull that off.
ReplyDeleteGood news is, I don't have to listen. But if that's your thing, good for you.
You know that segment was on The Musers and not TDZ, right? Get hung up on now, you idiot.
DeleteIs this Sirois? https://www.reddit.com/user/TheRonsterWithin/
ReplyDeleteThat is fucking amazing stuff, Zulu. I think it's Blake. Prissy. Alarmingly self-confident. Yes, it must be Blake.
DeleteYes, Blake and Mike Sirois both are regular perusers of Mississippi State, Ft Worth, and helicopter subreddits
DeleteIf you're for real offering to do 'remotes' at your subs' places for $698, you might not be in it for the long haul.
ReplyDeleteIf after a year and almost 5 months of being on-air and you're still referencing your former place of employment that's a direct competitor, you might not be in it for the long haul.
Second set begins at 11:00 PM sharp. Don't forget to tip the waitstaff and bartenders. And for fuck's sake, don't drink and drive.
https://radioink.com/2024/02/22/cumulus-media-takes-poison-pill-as-hostile-takeover-emerges/
ReplyDeleteWell that seems bad.
ReplyDeleteYeah, that article is a bit scary. Imagine all these guys doing pods in a few months. Not joking.
ReplyDeleteIt would be absolutely hilarious if in a few months, the Freak is still on the air and The Ticket is gone.
ReplyDeleteThat's not how it works. That's not how any of this works.
DeleteDid you see what this group did to Sports Illustrated, literally, overnight? I don't trust you.
DeleteThe hostile ownership could go to cheap programming across the board and still make out better on a national basis. Buyouts coming for Sturm and Corby et al. A Musers podcast would do very well.
ReplyDeleteThere is how shall we say a definite feeling of unease by everyone and I mean everyone at the Mothership. This particular plutocrat could give one shit about something local/regional, no matter how successful. Local/regional success does not exceed national mediocrity in profits. If this hostile takeover occurs, buckle up. At best you MIGHT have the Invasion and The Sweetspot as your "old school" shows. AM/PM salaries/contracts are eaten, for certain. That's best case scenario. More likely is either an execution en masse with national (cheaper) canned shows as the doo doo replacement, or a format change, or (even more likely) a liquidation of nearly if not all terrestrial radio operations across the country. It's this dude and his board's m.o.. Their m.o. is well established, by the way. He/they also do nothing but make obscene amounts of money by dint of said m.o..
ReplyDeleteThose are all things that are DEFINITELY happening. Really. Take their word for it.
DeleteTicket Fan Fiction: The Comet Strike Theory
ReplyDeleteAll the radio conglomerates are losing money and have declining revenues.
ReplyDeleteCumulus is a sh!tshow, but it is in worse shape than the others only by a measure of degree.
There are many possible futures of KTCK, but the 3 most likely scenarios are: (1) continued success; (2) sold; and (3) gradual decline due to cost-savings measures.
I honestly don’t see #3 as likely because KTCK continues to invest in the drivetime shows at the expense of other dayparts. A strategy that, like it or not, has not hurt KTCK.
The idea that we are going to wake up one day in 6 months & 96.7 will be play all Beatles is a complete fantasy.
The Ticket is consistently one of the top billers in the market in spot revenue. I believe they’ve won the market in total billing in 2 of the last 5 years. And that was before their absolute historic run of ratings in 2023. The idea that Cumulus is going to cut costs by cutting what could be their most profitable station in their most profitable cluster seems odd. Possible? Sure. And monkeys could fly out of all our butts also.
ReplyDeleteIt just cracks me up that this fan fiction is presented as fact- that there’s definitely a feeling of unease at the Mothership. While completely ignoring reality. The Ticket is at the top of the market. Not just “their” demo but ALL demos. While the Freak is languishing in the high teens or low 20’s and they’re billing is, if my sources are correct, down 40-50% year over year.
I see posts like the doomsayer above and become more convinced that some of these posters are the Kevin Turners and Joe Cucunellis of the world, desperately publishing their “Ticket is dying” fan fic hoping they can wish the Freak to success.
C
Again. This has zero to do with rhe health if The Ticket. It is solely about a billionaire corporate raider based in India who cares nothing about "billing" and everything about maximum profit. I ask you to actually read the article on the last thread and look into the person in question. After that, if you still want to cocky sniff, snark, and pat others on the head while shaking your enlightened head.... by all means. But I don't think you will.
ReplyDeleteOh yes. The doom is predicated upon the hostile takeover happening. Cumulus is teying to stop it via the courts.
ReplyDeleteYa C, you usually provide good insight here, but this doesn’t seem like it has anything to do with how the ticket is doing. The sports illustrated takeover is what makes it worrisome. The ticket doing well is like SI’s best writer getting the most clicks. He/she didn’t keep their job, everyone was gone.
ReplyDeleteC-
ReplyDeleteThe topic of conversation has nothing to do with either of your normal talking points: ratings and the Freak failing. I appreciate what you bring as far as the chatter inside the office, however. Have you heard anyone in the Cumulus cluster who’s aware of this hostile takeover attempt? Any inside reaction?
I know a couple of the sales guys up there and they’re aware and think it’s a nothing burger. Sports Illustrated wasn’t making money. Print is dead. Radio may be dying but it’s still making lots of money in certain places. One of the places where you can make money is the top of the ratings. With the poison pill, it’s doubtful the sale would happen, and like any business, profitable divisions are generally safer than revenue drainers. Could I see new owner selling off pieces? Sure but how much will they get for small market sticks? And the big sticks in big markets generate a lot of cash flow. It’s why insurance companies used to be owners, radio kicks out lots of cash flow. Especially when a company doesn’t have tons of debt. Some of the posts above seem to lack any sense of how businesses work. So this guy is going to pay a premium to buy Cumulus to destroy it because that’s what he does? How does that make sense?
ReplyDeleteC
I did read the article but maybe there is another article out there that says the exact opposite based on everything I see being posted here.
ReplyDeleteA corporate raider bought 10% of Cumulus publicly traded stock. The Cumulus Board executed a plan, which all but guarantees this guy can’t acquire 15% of the total company, which really means he has to actually deal with the Cumulus board if he wants to buy Cumulus & it sounds like they are not receptive.
As for SI, the Sports Illustrated most of us grew up with disappeared in 2018. The thing that replaced it has largely been irrelevant since that time. Out of curiosity, I went to SI.com (first time in forever) & they are still posting new articles so I am not sure what is up except to say the understanding that it ceased to exist a week ago seems to be inaccurate.
Just Wondering...which number is higher...Plainsman book sales or Dumb Zone paid subscribers?
ReplyDeleteYeah bruh. Did you get the juice from fellow Cult members you were looking for? Thirsty bruh. Parched, this one.
DeleteLast time, then all you of the smart set can have at it. Spend 15 minutes reading up on Manoj Bhargava and his Renew Group. They have a well established method/approach. C, et alia are looking at this from a commonsense business perspective. That is not what Renew trades in. They desire debt. And if debt is tied to a slow dying modality, all the better. Mr. Bhargava has no interest in a product (whatever it is). It's about purchasing debt to both offset other debts and holdings, as well as eventually be sold off at a large profit. If that means liquifying something that is profitable for future, larger profits, so be it. The Ticket per se is profitable (though not as much as some of you think), Cumulus is not. Global finance is not corporate media. Like I said, we ought to hope very much that this hostile takeover is avoided. While it doesn't necessarily mean The End or something damn close, it will in all likelihood mean changes that no one, from the station to the listener to advertisers will be onboard with.
ReplyDeleteI'm done. Fingers and toes crossed, this does not occur.
Ok, explain this to me like I'm stupid. But I'm reading your word salad. They buy debt to offset other debt? Can anyone explain how that is accounted for on a companies ledger? I owe a billion dollars and I'm going to buy another billion dollars in debt to "offset" the first billion, so instead of 2 billion I owe less? I've read a few things about this guy. But basic business principles still apply.
DeleteNo. I'm not being paid to educate you. You were woefully wrong about Dan and Jake and their case, you are even more so here. If tou find my words ponderous, then you have no understanding of global finance. Go f yourself and make a sale.
Delete@00110011
Not to negate any good that comes from these philanthropical ventures, but such deeds are in essence tax shelters. They must be done, and on a large scale.
OK. So I did read up on Renew and Manoj Bhargava. From what I can tell, yes he buys up media groups who've fallen into debt or even bankruptcy. He also is quite the philanthropist. I'm not sure if this woudn't be a good thing for The Ticket. Most every article I read paints a picture of a global business giant with an even bigger heart. From what I can tell he turns faltering ventures back into money makers. I'm in no way business savvy and haven't a clue about global finance, but from what I can tell, there seems to be a lot more positive than negative on this front. My two cents.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDelete"If tou find my words ponderous, then you have no understanding of global finance." This line gave me a good laugh, thanks for that. I can just picture the scene in my head as someone storms away. The only thing missing was the "Good day to you sir." Who ever thought we'd see the day where such a phrase would be used, much less as a sick burn, on a blog about the Ticket. Strange days, indeed.
ReplyDeletemost peculiar, mama
Deleteroll
DeleteGlad you got a chuckle out of it, KDF. Too bad you missed the contrary, retrograde motion of "Go F yourself and make a sale." Maybe next time, little buddy.
DeleteWhat was there to miss in that comment? It was rude, unduly hostile and not worth commenting on. I gave it all the attention it deserved, which was none. Manners Maketh Man.
DeleteThis place just gets weirder and weirder
ReplyDeleteI miss the old days when we could talk about shady used car dealers in west Texas with some degree of civility.
DeleteI thought of old Bart Reagor just the other day. Wonder how his act is playing in prison.
DeleteI am sure being the alpha male that he was he is a shot caller on the inside just like he was on the outside. /s
DeleteY'all Freqers ready??????? Put yer fanger in it. You dig?!?!?!?!?!?!?
ReplyDeleteNothing coming
Delete^^^^^^^^ Oh, KT. You are a vigilant one.
DeleteListening to the Dumbzone Lawyers roundtable. 1) Susquehanna was unethical in their treatment of the case 2) Susquehanna employees e.g. Dan Bennett lied in court 3) Susquehanna attorneys were unethical buffoons in their strategy. 4) Cumulus management used intimidation techniques. 5) One of the TDZ lawyers quipped that Cumulus station employees have Stockholm syndrome. Good stuff
ReplyDelete6) So says legal team representing clients in a case vs Susquehanna.
ReplyDeleteLook, they MIGHT be correct on all accounts, but come on. All Astros fans are enablers if cheaters, says the Rangers fan.
I take it there is no clause in the settlement prohibiting disparaging the other party. Because if such a clause is in effect, a can of worms might've been opened.
Frankly, I fail to understand why TDZ even did this. Move on. Stop living in a past you chose to leave behind. Their sub numbers are solid and golding steady, which is great. Focus on YOUR career and stop affording these lawyers a fresh five minutes of fame every few months. Because believe me, this is driven by their legal team. And a few if them are rather thirsty.
Hoping this will be the lend of it. Also hoping another court case isn't on the horizon.
They’re doing this because the audience wants to hear it. People find this interesting. I understand folks whose wildly incorrect predictions about how the lawsuit would go never want to hear about it again, but this is the most public and documented breakup in Ticket history. It’s entertaining.
DeleteTry a better jr high debate team tactic, lil buddy. #CultIsReal
DeleteQuote from DZ Fan:
Delete"I understand folks whose wildly incorrect predictions about how the lawsuit would go never want to hear about it again..."
Nailed it. 100%
I was interested in this 6 months ago. Now it’s like cam newton trying to make the news to get subscribers. Dan and Jake don’t need this imo.
ReplyDeleteI’m loving it. Can’t wait to hear Plainsman’s take on the legal strategy after hearing his speculative criticisms for so long
ReplyDelete@DZ
ReplyDeleteOG poster here. I'm a DZ sub. Therefore please stop thinking for me and other subs who also feel the same way about the lawyer/Ticket stuff. Your comment is also a non sequitur. Do you know what that means? It's a logical fallacy. A basic one, at that. It does not follow that criticism of TDZ entails any sort of prediction about their now settled case. While I'm digging most of what Dan and Jake are putting out, some of it does not interest me. Some of it is even annoying (like this latest lawyer/Ticket episode). By the way, I feel the same about Ticket content. So, again, please stop thinking and speaking for others who also share your affinity for TDZ. It's OK to criticize them. You can both critique and enjoy them (or anything) at the same time. Dan and Jake have a good thing going and I'm proud to be a part of it. But it doesn't mean it's perfect. Moreover, I'd hate to see them screw things up because awipe lawyers who love air time and exposure are unable to keep from shit talking. I very much hope there is no non-disparagement clause in the settlement. If such a clause exists, they might've royally fucked up here. Fingers crossed they haven't.
No disparagement clauses aren’t even legal, love
ReplyDeleteAre you serious? Legal EGL, my ass. Non-disparagement clauses are commonplace. Here's a primer, dumbass. I mean, love:
Deletehttps://www.mclane.com/insights/the-basics-of-non-disparagement-clauses/
Join us in this decade love
Deletehttps://www.dglaw.com/nlrb-finds-confidentiality-and-non-disparagement-clauses-in-severance-agreement-unlawful/#:~:text=The%20Bottom%20Line,in%20separation%20agreements%20is%20unlawful.
As one of those saying D&J were going to lose, I will say a couple of things. First, Cumulus handled the case extremely poorly. They took too long to act, which suggests there was no emergency or harm. They filed in federal court, which made the standard for getting a TRO & injunction higher. I don’t know why they did these things; there may have been reasons for doing so.
ReplyDeleteSecond, I was always of the opinion the juice wasn’t worth the squeeze. Noncompetes in radio are very common. It’s 6 months. Just do what everyone else in the industry does just deal with it. I also assumed they had an actual plan to do something more than a podcast.
They won. I guess they struck a blow against the man. I dunno if it stops Cumulus or anyone else from trying to enforce a noncompete in the future.
> "I also assumed they had an actual plan to do something more than a podcast.
DeleteThey hope/want to establish a sort of media network à la Barstool, one that features a few different topic-driven podcasts. While I personally don't see D&J heading up their own, I do think it's plausible that they'll eventually sign a contract with an existing podcast network.
I guess that’s a thing. Perhaps this is the thing that brings the glory to the genius who thinks brushing teeth is for suckers.
DeleteI’ll say one more thing about the Dumb Zone- If they are still doing Patreon in 6 months hovering around 5600 to 5700 paid subscribers, maybe they will be happy with that, but I’ll find that disappointing from 2 guys that were #1 in middays in a top 5 market.
ReplyDeleteif we're just rounding up to $500K in subscription revenue, and dividing that evenly between the three of them (Dan, Jake and Blake) that's $166K (gross) - probably less than Dan was making, a bit more than Jake and a LOT more than Blake - and generating that while also doing fewer shows, more scheduling flexibility and free reign on content - that feels like a pretty good life!
DeleteAfter six months plus, my experience tells me they've platued, while operating in this mode. To go to the next level is going to require some sort of new exposure from a top tier outlet, or a significant media spend on their part, and either way - a big dob of luck. Because I'm not a sub, and only see what they're doing from the outside, I honestly can't tell you if the content is capable of that next level. Based on the small amout of the free stuff I've listened to/watched... Maybe? Probably not in a direct subscription form.
They're currently making some choices, I suspect, are intended to attract subscribers - but history tells us actually discourages subscribing. They're making novice decisions on how to go about this, 100% understandable, but also shows they have no real expertise in the podcasting space driving this thing. (no, I won't go into specifics because that is what people get paid to do)
The fact they've been able to generate $500K in annual revenue, doing it this way, is a tesitmate to them. 99% of any other podcast would have been lucky to do 10% of what they've pulled. Good dudes, made a tough decision to bet on themselves and while I think they made the wrong decision - I admire them for going for it - I can't think of any radio people who found themselves in the spot they were, would have done the same thing.
$6.90 * 12 * 5700 = $471,960. Less 10.5% for Patreon is still giving ~ $420k gross profit to operate the business and fund salaries. I don't think they're disappointed.
DeleteWell, Dan and Jake might've "won," but if you listened to the lawyer episode, then you also heard Dan admit they owe their Legal Dream Team (patent pending) fees that go into the high six figures. No one worked pro bono. No one is getting a discount. High six figures is serious money owed. No puppet (puppet?).
Delete@Window Licker
DeleteYou're leaving out A LOT of expenses, which is tantamount to Michael Scott thinking meets a Ryan Howard (mis)understanding of basic economics even though money and time were spent on business school.
To be fair, he said “gross profit”.
DeleteDan said, and I quote:
Delete"and most of our lawyers were working for free"
Yes, gross profit, as in "Revenue less COGS." Where COGS are those things that vary directly with revenue. They don't have to buy new microphones every time they add a new listener.
DeleteBut thanks for the input, Creed.
(And, yes, I am also aware that microphones are asset purchases, not expenses, but when someone gets mad without knowing "gross profit" vs "net profit" I'm not going to get into the different financial statements with him/her, and said "microphones" for the absurdity effect)
DeleteDo some of you need a hug? Do you need a cookie? Maybe a switch to decaf? Why the level of hostility and rudeness over a radio show and station? Have a piece of pizza and chill out.
ReplyDeleteCongrats on the multiple shoutouts to the MTC commenters on the latest DZ eppy
ReplyDeleteI still think Cumulus had Jake dead to rights on his non compete since his clearly mentioned podcasting. I thought the interesting comment from part 1 was lawyer Liz saying she was the “hold on, worst case scenario” voice in the room. That while Matt and Phil were optimistic, Liz had to remind them they could also lose. Which is why I think they ultimately settled. I think the general consensus is that TDZ won. But I think Cumulus got something out this also. They sued talent that tried to break a non compete. That’s got to be unnerving for smaller market jocks that didn’t earn Dan McDowell money. They kept them from going to a competitor, either the Fan or the Freak. And while I don’t remember the exact timeline, by the time they settled, wasn’t there at least one full book of the new line up? If I remember, Invasion and sweet spot did decently, where it wasn’t a total ratings collapse. I think that told Cumulus that loosing TDZ wasn’t going to be that painful.
ReplyDeleteC
LOL, you still won't give up. Jake & Dan were never going to another station. Stop projecting on them so hard. Good heavens.
DeleteStill believe they will wind up on terrestrial radio.
DeleteI felt confident about it for a while. Who walks away from a dream job in radio without a thought out plan of your next step? Well, it ends up that Dan and Jake do.
DeleteI checked today, they’re at about 5600 subs. Rough math, 5000x7 is 35k a month, 420k a year. 10% to Patreon, double the producers old probable salary (40) to 80k and it’s 300k to split between Dan and Jake. They don’t have to deal with bosses, can set their own hours, take off when they want, etc. I thought for damn sure they’d be back on radio when the non compete ended, but now? We don’t see them back on the air unless the sub numbers crater and they’re desperate to reestablish themselves. Which may not happen. I gotta think McDowell has to be approaching 60. He’s CB probably thinking if he can ride this podcast for another 5 years he can retire if he wants.
C
Dan is over 50 but closer to 50 than 60.
DeleteWhile C Minus was wrong—consistently, so consistently—it doesn’t mean it was a good decision for them to make as it cost over 100k.
DeleteC Minus, you were wrong, don’t backpedal to the Cumulus approach being wrong, they wouldn’t have done it that way if they didn’t think it was the way to go.
Reading opinions about the NLRB & non competes along with Breunig’s commentary puts it into better perspective.
I think a lot of people were more disappointed in the Plainsman erring so wrongly on this. Maybe need to be more impartial in the future when you admittedly weren’t well versed in this type of law.
A real letdown more than C Minus having to swallow defeat.
Dan's 55. You need to factor in equipment, paying Rob Chickering, insurance for Dan, Jake, and Blake, etc., etc. The equipment/maintenance factor is a lot more expensive than you'd think. Especially if you're going to put on a top quality pod. More so if you're going to stream and do it professionally. Still, at this sub number it's more than doable and leaves enough left for healthy salaries. But. As C and others have pointed out: this is all contingent on sub numbers constantly remaining where they are, as the groundfloor. That's tough. At least it is in the long run. It also means a lot of hard work on their part. Hard, hustling work that never ends -- day/week/year after day/week/year. Maybe they have that in them. Maybe not. I wish them nothing but the best. It's always exciting to watch those who have the sack to just go for it. As someone else said, now that they had an entire show pulling the curtain back about their exit from The Ticket, I do hope they put it behind them and turn their entire focus on the product. Their future depends on it. Go Dan and Jake. Go Ticket, too.
ReplyDeleteOn another note: There is a genuine more than a whisper going around that iHeart is discussing a change for 97.1. I've heard two avenues being tossed around. 1. A complete re-tooling with all new talent, including more or mostly syndicated shows. 2. A format change to Pride. It's what you might think it is. An LGBTQ and adjacent issues/lifestyle format. Take none of this as hold onto your butts stuff. I'm just passing along what I'm hearing.
Add in also FICA/SSN taken out monthly for any employee plus sundry taxes that come along with running a business. And then there's dealing with all that and keeping up with/doing the proverbial books. If that's not your bag, then you also have to hire a CPA. On the whole, CPA fees for business are more costly than for individuals. Then there's selling yourself in order to generate sponsorship. Right now, that might come in the form of Ticket and/or Ticket adjancent sponsors who support TDZ. That won't be enough for the longer game. That takes a lot of time and energy. All of the above takes a lot of time and energy if you go the DIY route. The sort of time and energy that saps the creative life out of most. So now toss in a PR person/firm to the oost of operations. While you're at it, you're going to need far more often than you probably anticipate a tech specialist. They aren't cheap.
DeleteAll of which is to say, there's much on the dudes' plate. Godspeed to them.
I would think a Pride format would go over like a dead balloon. I was looking at the format & I don’t see selling to any local advertisers. (Insert Subaru dealer joke here). Not that there isn’t a sizeable LGBTQ+ population here, it just seems too niche for even that market. Obviously, I can be wrong, but I will note heart doesn’t seem to sold on the format since they put these on network on the HD2 feeds.
ReplyDeleteMy memory is that network talk doesn’t do well in DFW outside the big conservative names. It would, at least be cheaper. But a sad give up for a once great frequency
Considerng what TF is, would it surprise anyone if iHeart made another poor decision?
DeleteSo many typos in that post that I wish I could delete it
ReplyDeleteBeen there.
DeleteThey will be on The Freq soon enough.
ReplyDeleteAs a daily listener to 97.1, I would welcome that.
Deletetdz will not be on the freak. the freak will not be the freak by the end of this calendar year
ReplyDeleteneither will tdz be tdz by the end of the '25 calendar year
dan will be in birmingham, alabama manning matt 'i like 'em young' mcclarin's old spot
jake will be out of the game altogether rocking hard on his family's business and getting his rocks off with ijb and going all in on the local political scene with tc
you already know cumulus' legal team and strats are a joke
you'll also come to know that the whole stockholm syndrome thing was actually the legal dream team holding dan and jake hostage
later
lol on the lawyers holding them hostage. Tilt your head and look at it from a slightly different angle. They paid their lawyers a huge amount to be able to start their podcast in August rather than waiting 6 months. Go listen to Dan on a Cleveland podcast that's linked on their Reddit page. He says what cumulus got out of it was the intimidation factor for others. Also slips and says “70 thou, I don’t even know how much in legal fees, and most of our lawyers were working for free”. Was it worth. 70k to start the podcast right away ?
ReplyDeleteI’ll repeat, I think Cumulus was ready to settle because they’d made their point- “we will sue you over a non compete.” And they let them do the podcast because by the time they were in court, the August book had come out and shown that THZ was replaceable.
C
Wrong. Tilt your head and look at it from an angle that doesn't affix itself to your bizarre cult like attraction to a doucher rich boy frat boy who was a part of a sex cult in high school who is easily afforded progressive views due to both his family's and his wife's family' wealth and has no real world consequences vis a vis his kick ass ass kicking modus operandi and a wannabe comic who both offers nothing but a parrot of others' standup acts in conjunction with the aforementioned sadness the other trades in that in conjunction comports to their both particular psycho-sociological dispositions.
DeleteBy the by. You have no idea how the real world works. Good luck with your bottom on that one.
My Dad, Earl.
Baby, if you ever wondered. Wondered, whatever became of me.
ReplyDeleteOK OK OK. my babies. I thought the juice was ripe and ready to hydrate yo and self tuckus, ya know, to vitalize. But babies, I was premature like a crack a lack newborn. No no no, my wang dang don't need no blue or red or green pill sweet poon, nah ain't going there theater of the mind. That's all good. I'm talking about what I knew. What I know. To. Be. Real. Yo. Is absolutely most Toni Braxtonly real. Andy Travis is back, babies. So too is Dr. Johnny Fever. You know he has a Phd in Rock? You better you bet you mother scratchers. But here' the nipple tickler. My man Venus is back on the scene (as if he ever left, right?!, yo!). He be the candyman. the Wiz, the PFunk. Dig? You, I like.
d
Man you suck
DeleteYour mom.
DeleteWhy are there so many word salad posts on here recently? Something about any discussion of Dan and Jake brings out the mutants.
ReplyDelete#TheCultIsReal
DeleteAgree
ReplyDeleteMan, are we still bickering about this?
ReplyDelete(1) From the outset, this site questioned Cumulus's legal strategy and identified several very questionable moves (and sloppy pleading). Its inexplicable delays, including failure to go for a temporary restraining order immediately, where it could have gotten some preliminary relief without much proof of injury -- or any, there being authority for injury being presumed in such cases -- were the most serious, but not the only, errors that I and others identified.
I also agree with one of the comments above that filing this in federal rather than state court was a major error, as was initial reliance on Atlanta counsel.
In addition, it seemed clear from the hearing that was eventually held that Cumulus witnesses were not prepared, and that little effort had been made to satisfy the elements for injunctive relief. (Injunctive relief = a court telling someone they can't do something, rather than awarding damages.)
Handled properly, at the outset it looked like a fair-to-good case for Cumulus, but in the event, it devolved into a desultorily-prosecuted case its lawyers are not going to want on their resumes. Several of the lawyer Confessors and I did look on in wonderment as Cumulus frittered away its early technical advantages in a case where it should have done much better.
And, as a wise man once said, you never know what the ball gonna do.
(2) Result: Victory for Dan and Jake on the injunctive portion of the case, despite their violation of the terms of the noncompete. (The court did not find they did not violate their noncompete -- that wasn't what the hearing was about.) It was a deserved victory that owed a lot to Cumulus's bungling and outright laziness, but also to their own lawyers' pugnacity and energy.
(3) Second result: Victory for Dan and Jake in settling the case favorably thereafter. But the reason there had to be a settlement was that the victory on the injunction hearing did not end the case against them. The violation was still out there, and if Cumulus had chosen to proceed it could (with actual proof and evidence this time around, if there was any to be had) have sought money damages from the lads. Instead, it folded its tents and Jake and Dan were also off the hook for damages. So: Dan and Jake victory.
COMMENT CONTINUED
COMMENT CONTINUED
ReplyDelete(4) But a lot of the ink spilled on this case had to do with their lawyers' claims, urged both in the lawsuit and in the NLRB filing, that the noncompetes were illegal, which, if correct, would have ended the entire case against them (at least on the noncompete -- the trademark stuff didn't seem to excite anyone). The judge did not rule on that, but she hinted in open court that if the case had continued, Dan and Jake would have lost on that one, at least in her court. They could still be required to defend the damages case.
(5) I don't know what happened to the NLRB complaints, but if the settlement did not require their voluntary withdrawal (which is permitted under NLRB rules, although the NLRB can decline to permit withdrawal), that would be another jaw-dropping error by Cumulus. I tried (not very hard) to track down what happened to the complaints, failed. I believe one of their attorneys filed some kind of NLRB petition on his own behalf challenging noncompetes, but don't know what happened to that, either -- however, it does suggest that perhaps the Kemp/McDowell complaints were dismissed. If anyone knows how to track down what happened to those complaints, I'd be very interested.
(6) Where does that leave us? Victory for Jake and Dan despite thumbing their noses at the noncompetes. A gamble that paid off, but make no mistake -- it was a gamble. With better decisions and more elbow grease by the Cumulus team (and, by the way -- it's unclear whether all the errors were solely on the lawyers [some clearly were], or whether Cumulus reined them in for some reason), things could have ended badly for them.
Did Cumulus get any benefit at all out of this? Hard to see it, unless they stiffed their lawyers.
(7) Congratulations to Dan and Jake. I hope they thrive. The cash flow isn't gigantic, yet, but it's pretty good. I wonder, though, if they feel kind of lonely sometimes.
Matt Bruenig discusses the NLRB complaints on his March 3 podcast (The Bruenigs, on patreon). Basically, part of the settlement agreement required Bruenig to submit a withdrawal request, which he did. The NLRB has thus far declined to permit withdrawl of the charges. Soon after the withdrawal request, the NLRB regional director got the attorneys for both sides on a zoom call, and requested that the attorneys review the law and told them to review the law and submit a statement as to whether the felt Cumulus' actions were illegal. This put Bruenig in a bind because while in his opinion, the charges were valid, and what Cumulus was doing was illegal, to put that in writing after the settlement was already agreed to would certainly tick of Cumulus, but he didn't want to lie to the NLRB. So, he played it straight, sent a letter saying in his opinion what Cumulus was doing was illegal. This did piss Cumulus off and they threatened to go back to the judge. However, this kind of threat is also apparently a violation of the NLRA, so Bruenig sent them the applicable portion of the law, and demanded they retract their threat, or he would bring another charge against them to the NLRB. Cumulus backed off and retracted their threat.
DeleteNothing further has come from the NLRB as of this moment, the charges have not been withdrawn or moved forward, they are just sitting at the NLRB. Bruenig is surprised it is taking this long for something to happen. Bruenig has also separately filed charges himself against cumulus based on a bunch (17? or so) violations of the NLRB in their employee handbook. If the NLRB moves forward with the charges, both cases will be combined. I recommend subscribing to Bruenigs podcast, at least for a month to listen to this one podcast, it is a lot of good information.
Thanks to Jimbo for this clear account.
DeleteMan, I'd love to see that settlement agreement. I'm not a labor lawyer but even I knew that the NLRB could decline to allow a complainant to withdraw charges, which, under the current political slant of the NLRB on noncompetes, should have been seen as something that could occur and potentially rob Cumulus of a major benefit of the settlement. In that case, the settlement agreement should have provided that as a trigger to allow Cumulus to void the settlement or provide it with some other remedy.
DeleteI concede that second-guessing is kind of a coward's game (and anonymous second-guessing even worse), but there is so much that went on in this case that was, and remains, puzzling.
not that anyone cares, but Bruenig and Kingston somehow come off like even bigger assholes on the podcast than they are in real life - which is impressive.
ReplyDeleteevery time I've ever listened to, or read something from, Matt Bruenig - I have a sense he's a guy on some sort of personal legal crusade and his client is mearly a means to an end. I do not find him compelling or convincing. Just a guy who's got a goal and is going to force the result he wants - collatoral damages be damned.
ReplyDeleteAnd while I've not heard these newest podcasts, everything shared here just confirms what I assume the content to be.
Legit question: Has Bruenig accomplished any legal result of note? He very well may have, I just am not aware and wouldn't even know where to find that out.
oh, and I can personally attest from actual interaction - PK is an completely unlikable, and generally crummy, human being .
DeleteIndeed. Just ask his neighbors. I was once one of them.
DeletePlainsman- listen to lawyer episode 1 or Dan on the Cleveland podcast. Both flat out say part of the Cumulus goal was to intimidate other jocks in other markets. Probably worth a little $$ every now and then to the company, and it probably cost them less than TDZ if they used in house legal team, or company they have on retainer to handle stuff like this. Bet there’s a negotiated rate instead of lawyer MSRP.
ReplyDeleteAnd I went back and looked. Mid July to mid August ratings came out Sept 5th. There wasn’t a significant drop. The settlement was released the end of September and ratings came out that first week of October. I think Cumulus got what it really wanted, continued ratings success.
C
Yes I’m sure Cumulus would really want to go to trial and have their on air talent make them look even scummier. I’m pretty sure Bob will not lie under oath. Having said that Cat made cumulus look bad enough on his own.
ReplyDeleteReread the Wash Post article. Brunieg is a crusader, TDZ lawsuit was going to be explosive, get rid of non competes for thousands of workers nationwide. And…it fizzled. Why did it settle? Had TDZ reached out to the Fan of the Freak in violation of their exclusive negotiating rights period? Did Cumulus really have something in the claim that TDZ were contacting advertisers? Or did TDZ settle because as their lawyer Liz kept reminding them, they could lose this.
DeleteIMHO they bluffed their way to getting what they really wanted, the podcast. They folded when it came to standing up for the other little guys with non competes.
C
Just for the record, the NLRB case continues, so that angle isn’t dead yet. And now that it has been set in motion there is nothing D&J, Bruenig, or Cumulus can do to stop it. And by the way, Cumulus are the one’s that sued D&J so they weren’t crusading for anything to start with, unless you want to argue that D&J baited them into the lawsuit, in which case they are either geniuses for being able to forecast had badly Cumulus would f the case up, or they were just reckless.
DeleteI’ll add this- I think locally Bennett and Catlin would have been fat dumb and happy to extend THZ contract. But Dan Mcd made it clear their conflicts were with Cumulus corporate. They were the ones driving the no outside podcast revenue bus. I think Bennett would have been fine with THZ return. But when agreement couldn’t be reached, they were fine with hiring Matt, repositioning Mino, Bass et al as long as ratings held up. Ultimately they want ratings because ratings generally equal revenue.
ReplyDeleteC
It is apparent that Cumulus does not understand that The Ticket is different than all of their other typical radio stations. Think about trying to explain to someone at corporate that they need to pay a couple of midday hosts probably $500k or possibly more in combined salary when you can plug in a couple of spares for probably less than $150k combined and not really lose ratings. And they are probably right, in the short term anyway. But long term I think they will suffer. After the Musers and Corby retire the station is probably done, or at least they will sink to at or below the level of the FAN. Say what you will about Jake but he was the only one out of all the people in the farm system that had the talent to carry a drive time show (maybe Monty but he can’t even get a host gig).
DeleteWhile I don't exactly disagree with the premise of your statement, The Ticket has been pronounced dead about a dozen times based on the departure of someone for over 15 years now and they continue to thrive. I think it's time to quit thinking that the next departure is the one to sink them.
DeleteC-,
DeleteThey were asked to take a pay cut and in lieu of that wanted to be able to create other revenue streams. I think what you’re trying to say is that Cat and DB were ok with that but corporate wasn’t which you might be right.
I am in agreeance with you that this all could have been avoided by waiting out the non compete. I’m in disagreeance that they ultimately would have lost the case. The judge was intimating to Cumulus that settlement was the best course of action as she wasn’t going to push against the 1st amendment which would have cascaded to the non compete.
I think Cat and DB helped Cumulus see which way the wind was blowing and the long term damage of PK subpoena-ing guys like Bob, Corby, Gordo, etc. PK has made no qualms that he was willing to do what it would take to win the case I just don’t think Cumulus and even Dan & Jake had the stomach for it. He could bring in past and present employees including Rhyner to highlight hostile environment allegations.
While I would have liked to have seen that all play out, ultimately D&J wanted to podcast and not burn down a station that their friends work at.
I think as the years go by, you realize “friends “ you no longer work with are more like acquaintances as it is rare you ever spend any significant time with them again.
Highly doubtful in the 8 months since they’ve left KTCK that they’ve spent in person time with their “friends “.
Dan and Jake have said repeatedly that their quarrel was not about the money. They were satisfied with the salary portion of the contract offer from Cumulus. It was just the “other ventures” that they differed over, which eventually led to the split.
DeleteThe only folks who like The Freq are folks who never listened to The Ticket. People who had 97.1 already on their preset. Half of them or so tuned out.
ReplyDeleteNo
DeleteAnecdotally disagree, Poor the Legend. I’ve been a hardcore tickethead for 20 years and still listen to the Musers more than anything else. I’m not a freakhead, but I enjoy the downbeat podcast quite a bit.
ReplyDeleteCalm down, y'all, it's a podcast.
ReplyDeleteA podcast.
'Sup. What's clickin' chickens? So, yo. Check it out.
ReplyDeleteHustler be telling me don't be so down on the beat, yo. They good. Big pow wow in wigwam with chief and peace pipe. He sayum it's all good.
Don't let ya snizzle crawl up into ya dizzle, ya dig.
Peace out. Yo.
Whatever that means, I am happy for you. Or sorry that happened.
DeleteSo this and all the WKRP crap (it's obviously the same person) is some sort of Andy Kaufmannesque gag, right? Has to be. If so, in a weird way I almost look forward to each of of these insane, surreal, word salad absurdist attempts at getting an agenda of sorts across. It seems to me that if there is a purpose to this madness, it's either to annoy those the author finds her/himself annoying, or, merely to stir the pot and watch shit fly. Whatever the case, you sir or madam need counseling and in all likelihood meds.
DeleteThey are panic posts.
DeleteYou mean manic.
DeleteHowever moronically put, Gettin' My Krafty On is actually correct in saying that TDB had a meeting with management this week. In fact, I've been told all shows met with management. What was said and how it went, I've no idea. From a few hints found on reddit/freak and on X, it does seem that something's up. When you have on-air talent saying things like, for example (paraphrasing here): "Given the current climate, I don't think talking about anything radio business or management related is a good idea," it's safe to say management-employee discussions are being had. As such it isn't unfair to read between the lines and come to the conclusion that either change is coming and/or if numbers don't change, change is coming.
ReplyDeleteWe are being told Le Freq is, ahem, transitioning. Hold onto them or set them free. Either way, love ya'lls buns.
ReplyDeleteBreaking News: a radio station that is struggling in the ratings is having internal conversations about this fact.
ReplyDeleteGo back to reddit where you belong, Regonk. Your piss poor attempt at snark fell flat. The pee drinkers on reddit will be far more appreciative, receptive of your weak attempt.
DeleteEase up Catlin. Go get another sleeve on the other arm
DeleteHi redditor. Bad snark bruh. 2017 stuff. Try again, try harder.
Deletehttps://ratings.radio-online.com/content/arb024
ReplyDeleteSo again, KEGL did worse this month than the holiday ratings period. How are they still on the air?
DeleteSeriously, when does iHeart put this abomination of a turd out of its misery?
DeleteHopefully this "abomination of a turd" sticks around for a while. Some of us quite like it and the local alternative it provides.
DeleteWell, Jimmy, if there were a lot and I mean A LOT more like you out there, it probably would. But there isn't and there's no calvary charging hard with aim to save the day. There's also the stubborn fact that excepting the very few, such as yourself, listeners fail to find any show even somewhat interesting. Don't get me wrong, I really wanted a genuine alternative listening option. One that would foster healthy competition and force the top dog to give it their best. It would've been a win-win all around for everyone. That's not what happened. Glad you like what they offer. Again, you are the exception. So enjoy it while you can, as it's not long for the radioscape. Maybe Danny and Sirois will continue on in pod or stream form? There might be something in that.
DeletePete's ratings post is up
ReplyDeleteGoodwill running out for middays.
Deleteis it? it didn't for THZ when it came out the gates slow and everyone was dogpiling on the PD for pairing Jake with Dan in the first place.
DeleteThat really is the most comedic aspect of all this newly formed division - I'd kill to see a Venn Diagram of TDZ Champions and "P1's who told Cat he was a f'ing idiot for pairing D&J together".
Exactly, Knob. Don't let hard facts get in the way of The Narrative. Check out reddit/ticket. The idiots are excoriating Peter for having the temerity to post the ratings and explain them and historically situate the data.It's flat out fucking nuts. Meanwhile, over at reddit/thedumbzone the pee drinkers are actively tryimg to ban a commenter who dare deigns to opine there may be another side to legal proceedings. It's a little bit frightening to watch the mob gather. #TheCultIsReal
DeleteThe reaction by TDZ fans to Peter’s posting on Reddit was appalling.
DeleteLike the company you keep, your audience is often a reflection of you. There is something about Dan and Jake that seems to attract the nasty, the ill-informed, and those who readily conform to the will of the crowd. Which, of course, is ironic when you consider how progressive and against the grain both these folks and their dear leaders hold themselves to be.
DeleteYa, I think you’re onto something. Before the departure or anything, the hangzone fan boys were completely ridiculous. People on Reddit would post how they’re the best show randomly when the show wasn’t even on. And this is for a show that in its grand scheme of things, was in its infancy. The musers undoubtedly had more fan boys, but they didn’t seem as swifty about it.
DeleteMusers fan boys are generally well beyond middle age and don't use reddit
DeleteIs that a dig? If so, how sadly executed. Agist, to boot.
DeleteHere's the link to the ratings post, which I put up yesterday.
ReplyDeleteymmv
https://www.reddit.com/r/theticket/comments/1bimr1y/february_24_ratings
So much appreciated, Peter. Wi those 50s!
DeletePeter: Your keeping us up to date here is much appreciated.
ReplyDeletemy pleasure - yesterday was pretty entertaining. I generally don't engage in the comments to those posts, but I tried to answer questions that I thought came from a place of good faith or in one instance something that was just outright inaccurate (That I am 'forced' or paid to post them) because it appeared to be people who'd never seen it before.
DeleteWhat took place on reddit was an embarrassment. That page is beyond toxic and has a collective IQ that makes a green mollusk look positively brilliant.
DeleteLook everyone, "Mr. Giggles" thinks something is an embarrassment.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
DeleteLook everyone. Get Real is perhaps the worst snark bunny in the game. Sorry, Get Real, you lose.
DeleteNew thread/red.
ReplyDelete