Wednesday, November 13, 2013

FROM THE ARCHIVES: Seems Like a Good Day to Review My Unworkable Cowboys Proposal

Yesterday on the Musers when they did their Fabuloso Fan Feedback or whatever it's called, the first P1 email cited by Junior was a guy who said that someone should look to putting another team in Cool Metro.  This reminded me of my proposal of awhile back that earned absolutely no notice whatsoever, because, in all likelihood, it is completely impossible.  (As Junior said the P1's proposal is.)  Unless I can find some guys with crazy money.  I re-offer it today because as America's Team continues to slip irreversibly into becoming only Jerry's Team, everyone's got a solution.  So here's mine, again, from January 28, 2013.

*     *     *

The Time Has Come to Reveal My Far-Fetched but Deeply-Held Belief on Solving the Problem of Perpetual Cowboys Mediocrity; or, The Brontosaurus Theory

Confessors, with a title like that, I deem that you have been given fair warning that this is one of those blessedly rare Plainsman sportsy posts, wherein I demonstrate rather small knowledge about sports.  I suppose that's what comes of listening to The Ticket.

But, in honor of the entrepreneurial spirit embodied in Danny Balis (there's your Ticket connection for this post), let me ask you to put aside preconceived notions and use your imagination.  You can probably come up with some variations of what follows that may make more sense.

The conventional wisdom – and this view is held not only by me and many of you, but by an acquaintance of mine who might in fact be the No. 1 Cowboys fan in DFW, I kid you not – is that the Cowboys will not return to greatness as long as they are owned by Jerry Jones.  That the Cowboys will, in fact, get worse as his ego continues to eat away at judgment with the passing years.  Because Jerry Jones will not give up control as he struggles to cast off the shadow Jimmy and win a title for which he can claim principal credit.  And because Jerry Jones will not sell the Cowboys, their averageness-or-worse will soil that beastly stadium out there for years to come.

I grant that this is a very likely scenario.  But it is not the only possible scenario.  Let me toss out a few concepts.

Jerry Is a Very, Very Bad General Manager and Owner.  I won't spend much time on this, we all know it.  His latest machinations, castrating Jason Garrett, loading up the coaching staff with people he selects, is a recipe for failure.  It is widely accepted that 2013 is make-or-break for Garrett – but what earthly sense does it make to (1) reduce his responsibility for the offense and (2) stick him with personnel not of his choosing and then to increase his accountability?  I happen to think Garrett bears a large share of the blame for fielding offenses that apparently don't know the plays after two-plus years and that can't get them called before a half-second remains on the play clock.  Maybe Jerry has selected players of incorrigible stupidity, but more likely is that they're not prepared, or the plays require calls that are not appropriate for the hurly-burly of the gridiron, or Tony doesn't transmit the playcalls efficiently.  But if that's the way you as GM feel about the guy, fire him, don't play games for another season that do nothing more than establish the head coach's lack of authority and your own poor judgment, begging yet the further question:  What accomplished, self-respecting coach would play for the  meddlesome savant-wannabe caricature that is Jerry Jones? 

And he's a bad owner because he refuses to hire experienced professional football management, or listen to the people in his organization who fit that description.
Since we all pretty much believe that Jerry is incompetent, why do I even bother to mention it?  Because:

Jerry Jones Is So Incompetent, That in the Process of Manufacturing Year After Year of Mediocrity and Worse, Jerry Jones Is Also Managing to Embarrass Texas in General, and, in Particular, the Wealthy of Texas.   Jones is pathologically incapable of keeping his piehole zipped.  And in its unzipped state, it emits torrents of disconnected phrases, 180-degree contradictions within a single breath, and downright nonsense.  It would be tolerable and possibly even charming if he'd shown a molecule of talent for running a football team, but since he hasn't, he looks like the kind of Texan, especially the kind of rich Texan, that non-Texans like to sneer at – ignorant, arrogant, incoherent. (Although he was born in Los Angeles and raised in Arkansas.)  The kind who thinks it's classy to hang the world's biggest video screen in his stadium, so big it renders the live contest irrelevant, and to feature caged go-go dancers.  You can't tell me that his pals in whatever the Rich Guy Club is in these parts (um, I don't belong) don't cringe when they see his latest high-wire act before any nearby open mic and hear everyone, even media types who might be expected to curry his favor, shaking their heads in disbelief that this well-meaning but thoroughly deluded soul is helming the destruction of the most valuable sports franchise in the country. 

There Are Lots of Really, Really Rich People in Texas.  And when you put a few of them together, a billion here, a billion there, pretty soon you're talking about real money.  And maybe they'd rather people think of them more like J.R. Ewing, and not J.W. Jones.

Everything Has Its Price.

Including Jerry.

Ah, but you say, Jerry does not have his price.  His pride would never let him sell the team while it's down, before it does something really terrific, at least get to a Super Bowl if not win it.

I agree that Jerry will never accept market value for the team, however that may be measured (although every year there are organizations purporting to do it, including one that reported today).  

So the first step is for a bunch of these rich guys who have had enough losing and ridicule to get together and offer Jerry crazy money.  I don't know how crazy it would have to be to let Jerry claim that as his ultimate victory.  Maybe he wouldn't take it.  Maybe the crazy money would have to be so crazy that not even a consortium of the extremely wealthy would consider offering it.  I would, however, ask you to remember the difference between the price Nolan Ryan's group agreed to pay for the Rangers at the outset, and what they eventually paid after Mark Cuban got the bidding way up there.

Then what?


Find some way to let Jerry save face.  Make him Chairman Emeritus.  Name the stadium after him and pay him for the right to use his name.  A permanent suite at the stadium.  (With parking!)  Perhaps work something where he keeps the stadium or some piece of it.  There are all kinds of ways to compensate selling business owners.   Insist that they pay him personally millions not to take his incomparable football management skills to any other NFL team.   Give him a consulting deal and actually have meetings and let him have his say.

OK, let's say that none of this moves the old Razorback.  

There's always:


How do you get leverage over an ego?

Include Stephen and Jerry Jr. in the Consortium.  Is Stephen Jones the Prince Charles of DFW or what?  Waiting for His Majesty to abdicate or die.  Perhaps it would be meaningful to Jerry (in addition to the crazy money, let's not forget) to know that his beloved offspring would have some kind of management and ownership role, and that he'd still have his son's ear on matters Cowboys, even if he would have no authority.  I can imagine that the boys (!) would have some reluctance to show up with a group offering to buy the team – I'm sure they love and feel loyalty toward their Pop and might fear a family falling-out if appearing to want to oust him.  Still, there may be creative ways to involve them in a subtle and diplomatic approach that would not offend Jerry.

The Brontosaurus Theory.  But here's my gee-whiz solution, and I'm sure that there are NFL-savvy readers out there who will tell me that this could never, ever happen in a squillion years. 

But, like Anne Elk (John Cleese) who offers her theory on the brontosaurus on Episode 31 of Monty Python's Flying Circus, this is my theory, and it is mine, and belongs to me, and what it is, too.  The next thing you will read is my theory:

This rich-guy consortium goes to Jerry – again, with their crazy money, maybe really crazy in light of this (my) theory and the thinking they want to inspire in Jerry, and they say this: 

Jerry, we have crazy money for you.  You know as sure as you're sitting there that this is easily a 30% premium over the highest valuation that any so-called expert places on this team.  You take that and walk away and you can hold your head high, laughing at your critics, knowing that win or lose, you, by the sheer force of your personality and will and balls in getting that stadium built, and, yes, winning three Super Bowls, created immense, incredible value, made this the second most valuable franchise in the world, second only to Manchester United.  Incredible accomplishment, Jerry.

You take this crazy money, Jerry.  You take it.  We'll put your name on that stadium.  Take a look at this term sheet, there's a bunch of other goodies in there, and looky here, Jerry, we're going to give Stephen and Jerry Jr. the opportunity to invest at a very high level and give them significant management responsibility.  You can be Chairman Emeritus.  

Take this crazy money, Jerry, and all the rest, because if you don't take this crazy money, we're going to keep an appointment that we made some months ago with Roger Goodell to discuss with him our strong commitment to putting an NFL team in Fort Worth, Texas.  As you can see, it will be hugely well-financed, with a stadium – oh, Jerry, it will not be a stadium like yours – it will be a big stadium, for sure, but it will be one that people will love, a real Texas stadium, like Fort Worth is a real Texas city, like people love the Ballpark at Arlington.  It'll be right near downtown -- those city fathers know how to work with businessmen.   Maybe we'll swipe Jacksonville or some other lame franchise – maybe we'll argue for expansion.  And Roger Goodell will listen, because Texas is a football state, and DFW is a gigantic market with lots and lots of people who have given up their Cowboy season tickets and lost all faith in you, and because major and lesser markets have fielded two NFL teams at once:  New York, Bay Area.  Crazy money, Jerry. 

You think your fellow owners would never allow it?  Think again.  Crazy.   And when we get that franchise -- don't you doubt us, Jerry, you know who we are -- we are going to treat our fans like royalty and we're going to get the best football people in the country and we're going to have a fracking party every week over in crazy Fort Worth over this team we're going to put together, Jerry.  Ground floor fans who don't give a bag of dirt about what your franchise did 20 years ago.  And we'll grab your fans, we'll grab your concession dollars, we'll grab your capital appreciation, we'll grab all of it and we will keep grabbing.

Because that is how we got this crazy money in the first place.  

It won't be hard . Crazy money, Jerry.  We got it.  We can get more.  

Because we're winners.  

Sign here. 

*     *     *

A bit melodramatic, perhaps.  And with a number of strategic difficulties. But God, that was fun.

Here's my point – we shouldn't assume that no circumstances exist under which Jerry would consider selling the team.  You won't know until you try.  Until you try, and let it leak that you're trying.  And I'm serious about a Fort Worth team.

So here's the plan, Confessors.  Send the link to this post to all of your billionaire friends.  Let's see, do I know any billionaires, let me think  .  .  . 


The Plainsman said...

Junior also said something else I've been mulling over for several seasons, which is that someone should be looking into the Cowboys' strength-and-conditioning coaching program just like they're looking into every other aspect of the Cowboys' feckless coaching program. I know every NFL team has injuries, but jeez, what a fragile bunch of large men this has turned out to be.

Anonymous said...

Interesting concept, to be certain. 1960 through 1962, we enjoyed having the Dallas Texans and the Dallas Cowboys in our fair burg. The metroplex could not support both teams during that time, but fast forward to 2013 and look at the growth of the area, that very well may be a possibility. It works (somewhat) in Oakland and San Fran and they are only 12 miles apart. It would probably resemble something like the Jets and Giants fan that touts tradition and history and another that is just trying to gain attention. Interesting concept nonetheless.

Shaggy said...

I think it's time for Jerry the owner to fire Jerry the GM.

Anonymous said...

I love it but the real money in this area is in Collin County. Put an NFL team in Plano. Call them the Texas Roughnecks.

Anonymous said...

I agree completely with the comment about the money being in Collin. I live there, and I know many football fans who refused to drive to Jerry-World to watch his team play. Old school Dallas seems to think of Arlington as the center of the Metroplex... Economically and demographically, the action is shifting toward North Dallas, Plano, Frisco, Allen. Build a Stadium where Valley View Mall now stands, with access from the Tollway and LBJ, close to the restaurants and sports bars of Addison. Get a quality owner, GM and Coach. Build a fan-friendly and competitive team... And they will come.

The Plainsman said...

In rereading my deathless prose, I am mortified to realize that I neglected to include a role for Charlotte in the new consortium. Considering what I've been hearing from Stephen the past year,Charlotte may well be the sharpest one of the bunch.

The Plainsman said...

I think it needs to be "the Texas Plainsmen."

Anonymous said...

So what was the big announcement on the musers this morning?

East Texas P1 said...

"I think it is time for Jerry the GM to turn in his resignation to Jerry the Owner." (Due props to whatever show I heard this on.)

Anon 1:30 - Ticketstock will be held Jan 24 and 25 at the Dallas Convention Center.

Anonymous said...

This thread is going to break the scrolling wheel on my mouse.

Anonymous said...

I can appreciate the sentiment of the re-posting of your article, Pman, but it's a rather Sisyphean discussion, much less endeavor. One thing I'll say: you're dead on in your addendum. Anyone out there who thinks Stephen Jones, once at the helm, will steer the ship right hasn't been paying attention to him over the past 3 or so years. He is a carbon copy of his father--except without the actual wildcatter successes. If there is a hope, from what I hear, it's Charlotte. Evidently she is the sole voice of reason, of sanity, at Jones' Inc.

To pick up from the last thread. . . . I've also found myself tuning in to ESPN afternoons and pm drive more and more. What's more, I've been sticking around longer. On more than one occasion I've suddenly realized that I've missed two or more HL segments. In other words the content, the hosts on ESPN (specifically Mosely, Freedo, and Cowlishaw) are interesting, funny, smart, and for me at least, strike a nice balance between goof around and sports. They tend to be much more sports heavy, which I don't mind. The other factor they have is their collective time spent in the Dallas media scene. Each brings an insider perspective: from Freedo's years inside the booth with luminaries such as Norm and Galloway to Moseley's print and radio experience to Cowlishaw's extensive and "big time" involvement in both print and tv. So you get a lot of experience and a lot of insider stuff. Like a couple of commenters on the other thread said, and I agree, THL had better step up their game. If they continue to coast like they have been for years now, I think they're going to find themselves in unfamiliar territory, sooner rather than later.

Anybody have any ideas about the 20th anniversary celebration that's going down at Ticketstock? Odds for a Greggo appearance? I do follow him on Twitter, and it seems like his sole occupation in life now is to tweet photos of the olden golden Ticket halcyon days. Perhaps a little bit of foreshadowing??? Any thoughts?

Anonymous said...

As long as Danny and Rhyner are alive and still at The Ticket, Greggo will never darken the halls of the little one. WAY too much bad-blood.

I too found myself listening more to ESPN now that Grandpa Urine is gone. Nice little break whenever things get over-the-top with THL. However, Mosley's "sh" on words that have an "s" can be annoying. But content wise, it's not bad.

Can't knock Stephen Jones too much. Years ago when a reporter asked Jimmy Johnson what it would take to come back into football and coach the Cowboys, he said "if Stephen was the ower, I'd be on his doorstep in the morning."

Gopher said...

One has to hope that Stephen is just toeing the company line right now to keep Dad happy.
Let him run the contracts and cap situations and the rest of the family handle the stadium and bring in a "good" football general manager. Things might change. Until Jerry is completely out of the equation that's not likely to happen.

Anonymous said...

Kind of weird that there are so many ESPN and Fan fanboys posting on here. Seems suspicious at the very least.

As far as a stadium in Plano, I think that's pretty myopic. You think there's a lot of fans in Collin County? Go to Midlothian, White Settlement, Granbury, Rockwall, get the idea. I was a fan of the stadium being in Dallas proper but the idea that Plano has a lock on Cowboys fandom is pretty short sighted. Collin County has the Rough Riders so be happy with that.

Anonymous said...

Because I say I'm enjoying what's going on over at ESPN of late neither makes me an ESPN Fan Boy nor is it very interesting. I went on to ask about Ticketstock and the anniversary. The only thing "interesting" is why some people find each and every comment that says something positive about another station to be "interesting."

Anonymous said...

By interesting, I think it's obvious I meant suspicious.

Anonymous said...

I live in Collin County, and I have not and will not put one red cent in Jerrah's pocket. He is a laughing stock...laughing all the way to the bank. Even though he continually fields a fragile half-assed team...he continues to make money. You want to get his attention, stop going to the stajium, stop buying cowboy paraphernalia.
The bottom line is that as long as people continue to give Jerrah money, nothing will change. He is Al Davis, and he is shuffling the deck every few years and hoping that he gets lucky one of these years, the stars line up and HIS team actually performs and at least gets to the big game...maybe even win it. Then he can snub his nose at all the critics that actually love this once proud franchise that has become a laughing stock.

Jerrah is an idiot, but it's his team and the more people criticize it the stupider he gets.

Anonymous said...

Fun to toss around far-fetched theories! Great post! But there's a fatal flaw in your argument, and it's your leading premise: Jerry may be a bad GM, but he is NOT a bad owner. He is, in fact, a genius owner. What does Jerry know? Promotion and investment. And he's the best there is in sports.
The mediocrity of the Cowboys had been well chronicled, but what had happened during that time? The cowboys have only grown in their local AND worldwide brand appeal. And built a billion-dollar stadium. And become one of the top 3 sports franchises in the world in estimated worth. How has Jerry the owner accomplished this? With the help of Jerry the GM, of course! Drafting players like Dez, trading for players like TO and Pacman and the rest. Keeping them on the front page. That's why Jerry doesn't get a "football man" in there, because football doesn't sell merchandise like soap operas do.
So, as a fan, you wish he ran his franchise like Cuban does. But more objectively, you have to recognize Jerry as one of the most brilliant owners in sports. Winning, for an owner, isn't everything.
--P1 Mike

The Plainsman said...

P1 Mike aka 1209 Anon: I have considered the very point you are making here, and it is a conundrum for people like me who would actually like to see the Cowboys win.

But that is the reason for the solution that I've hit on -- competition. If a DFW team can have that kind of success with mediocrity, incompetence, and mortifying incoherence, think what a team that has some respect for professional football management could accomplish. I think a well-financed NFL franchise here with the same management philosophy as, say, Rangers ownership, would suck enormous numbers of disgusted Cowboys fans who presently have nowhere to turn.

And I think Jerry is smart enough to know that is exactly what would happen, which is why a credible threat to bring a new NFL franchise to Cool Metro might persuade him either that it was time to sell the team, or to retire to whatever island he's buying with that annoying Papa John's jocksniff guy and dump the mess on Stephen and Charlotte.

Cowboys fans may be mindlessly loyal to this crap, but they're not mindless -- they know this isn't a good product and they know the stadium is a punchline, I don't think it would be hard for a lot of them to switch loyalties to a team with ownership and management that shows them some respect.

General Motors had a rep for genius management up until the moment those little Hondas started hitting our shores. IBM management were regarded as gods until Compaq and Dell and the others had a better idea. Jerry will be a great owner right up until the moment people have a choice.

The Plainsman said...

Hey, has anyone had the experience of tuning into 96.7 OR 1310 and having NewsRadio 820 WBAP come blaring forth? It's happened to me a couple of times. Doesn't last long. Like someone threw the wrong switch.

Anonymous said...

I think I agree with you. But what I wonder is this: would a "boring" winner (think SA Spurs) be more popular than a wild, crazy, soap-opera team? I'm not sure. I think part of the growth of popularity of the Cowboys is the fact that they're always in the news and have tons of talking points. I am not sure I buy the idea that a winner would automatically be more popular. But maybe...
P1 Mike

Anonymous Guy 4 said...

You are looking at the NFL as if it's a free market where someone with the money can add a team in any city that they want to.
It doesn't work like that guys, any addition/movement of a team has to be approved by the owners group.
They would never allow another team here in Dallas, it would never happen. They already have this market sewn up.
You would have to have at least 1 team if not 2 teams in LA before the owners would even consider adding a team anywhere else in the US.

NIce idea though, I would live to see Jerr squirm.

cactusflinthead said...

Pass that stuff over here Pman, think you have had enough.

Trying to remember where I heard it a few years ago, but there is an economic theory floating around out there about buying sports teams and art. Why do things like Monets and Lakers go for way more money than anybody predicted they would? Because there is a value to them beyond the money that is intangible except to those who want to buy it so they are willing to exceed the nominal value for a value far exceeding the paper one. The Cowboys, Yankees, Red Wings, Lakers and whatever Picasso comes on the market next are representative of this. You are not asking him to sell an object or company which he has no emotional investment. The financials of the business side have very little to do with it for him. This is all about ego. You are asking him to emasculate himself and sell his ego. That he will never, ever do. His precious.

Go back to the interview of Jimmy. What was the signal to him that it was time to go? Tony Casillas. He heard about the acquisition of that player and asked Jerry. What was Jerry's reply? "I can make a ten million dollar deal and nobody cares, but if I sign a third string offensive lineman it is all over the news." THAT is why Jimmy left and why Jerry will never ever sell the team. Jerry will not sell at any price to anybody.

blergoyen said...

I don't know about you guys, but there has definitely NOT been enough New Orleans talk this week. I'm looking forward to tomorrow and the possibility of even more New Orleans talk, possibly on all 3 major shows this time!

T4 In Rockwall said...

I have noticed one at least two occasions that WBAP comes on instead of the Ticket on 96.7. It's almost like a nightmare that I've awoken from and that the Ticket is not actually on 96.7.

Anonymous said...

I'm opposite on NO talk. I don't care about 46 year old Danny's party scene. Even if he's perpetually going on 24. From what I'm hearing, Jake sounds like a total ass after a few beers. So I'm out on Big Easy talk.

Anonymous said...

The NO talk is just one example of how limited the life experience level is of most of the Ticket gods. They take a little trip to New Orleans and act as though they have just discovered the lost temple of the Aztecs.

The Plainsman said...

Anon 1000: I think our good friend birq was having us on, a bit of sarcasm there. It is my firm belief he is with you on NO talk.

The Plainsman said...

Re ESPN afternoon show, Mosley and Cowlishaw.


Pretty good. Pretty good. Maybe better than pretty good.

But: Someone needs to spend some time teaching Cowlishaw how to speak into a microphone -- actually, how to speak. I'm okay with non-pro voices (you can't listen to The Ticket not being okay with it), but Cowlishaw's delivery is very halting, like he's perpetually out of breath, and his sentences trail off into inaudibility. It distracts from what he has to say and the presentation generally.

Having spilled more pixels on what irritates me than what I like, I'll just say it again -- pretty good little show . . . .

blergoyen said...

Birq? And yes you are correct Sir.

The Plainsman said...

Oops, sorry blergoyen. You're a good friend too. Got my sarcastics mixed up.

The Plainsman said...

Anon Guy 4: I believe you will find upon review of their presentation above that my Crazy Money Guys have greased Goodell and the owners.

But your point about LA is worthwhile. Too bad. I think another NFL team would flourish if associated with Fort Worth/Tarrant-Denton Counties and it showed signs of respecting professional football management. (Jerry's co-opted Collin with his Frisco initiative.)

Anonymous said...

Pman, you do know that Cowlishaw is on a daily ESPN tv show "Around the Horn," don't you?

Anonymous Guy 4 said...

P'man -
I agree that a team in Tarrant County would flourish, and I would absolutely love another team locally.
I live in Frisco, and can't believe the level of rediculous political shenanigans that persist up here so I was not surprised that the Boys are moving on up. This is the kind of place that was made for Jerry.
It will be interesting to see how things change politically in Frisco once the money tree that is "new development" dries up, but the blue star will be entrenched by then.

birq said...

Me? Sarcastic? Yeah, right.

Back to the topic: I'd own a Frisco Glory Holes jersey the day they went on sale.

Anonymous said...

Gagreed with all about New Orleans talk. Didn't we hear these same stories earlier this year? It was a week long of "how I partied in N.O. during the Super Bowl trip" stories. S***, I remember we were "treated" to a 2 part, 2 day segment of all the bands that Grandpa Mike went to see. Nothing against the dude, personally, but how many flippin' Jake vacay segments have we had already this year? Europe, N.O., Norman, have I missed any? He's a board op with a weekend show. I remember the days when everyone would go on drydock for 2 weeks, come back, and do a segment for each person's vacay. Boom. It was over, and it was interesting. Like most all things negative about The Ticket, it's mostly a Hardline thing. Like Plainsman and a few others, I too am enjoying the pm drive sounds over at 103.3. I now have an alternative to what was once my favorite show, be it radio, tv, pod, whatever. It sucks that it's come to this. But it has. At least I now have something to punch into once I punch out on The Hardline.

The Plainsman said...

1024: I knew he was on some kind of show but I don't watch ESPN unless it's on in the locker room at the gym or maybe at a local saloon. He might be easier to understand if you can look at him while he talks.

It's not that he's impossible to make out, it's just a real halting, trailing-off way of talking that doesn't come across well over the Philco.

As I say, my first impressions of the show are highly favorable, so Cowlishaw's hesitant pipes aren't a big factor.

So far, though, I'm still tuned in to The Hardline.

MoronDog said...

Has anyone else noticed the Reliant Air Conditioning "Gimic Free" commercial? It seems like it's on every break on the stream, and right now they are offering a free carbon monoxide detector with a service call. Isn't that a gimic???

Anonymous said...

Of all the Corby blowhardom that is so off-putting his hard-on for Pearl Jam has to be at the top.

Anonymous said...

Pearl Jam talk is a beating. THL is now consistently unoriginal.

blergoyen, not birq said...

yeah, but corky's friend is so high up on the Pearl Jam fan food chain, he gets a free ride from his house to all local concerts on a cleopatra-like, human-powered throne and a BJ from Mike McCready's barber. You see, corky's connected in like a hundred million different ways.

Anonymous said...

Can't believe I'm saying this because in m eyes he's been the sole thing that's kept it together.....but I can't take Danny anymore. He's gone from the cool guy you'd love to be pals with to the aging hipster snob too kewl for school taste maker you wish would never leave the s that white people like confines of the Bishop Arts District. Between Mike's utter lack of giving a rat's ass about anything other than has been musical acts and Corby's and now Danny's douchery, I'm about done with THL.

Anonymous said...

Anon 8:34, I am right there with you. THL is a turn-off man, from top to bottom.

Corby and Danny are so cool that they are elitist assholes. And those two guys are the biggest example of the hosts not having a clue about much of anything at all but always laying out facts to back it up.

THL has run it's course, they really need to be put out to pasture. I am glad to hear that 103.3 may be the answer, I'm gonna give it a shot.

cactusflinthead said...

Ok in the midst of all this I want this question answered in some form or another. "Do you hold out any hope of the Cowboys being a contender?"
Do you drink the Kool-aid? Do you think that they are going to change? Are you in the midst of a toxic relationship? Shall they turn the Titanic around?

Just wondering where the commentariat stands.
My illusions ceased to be. The delusions are all shattered. Until He goes the way of the dodo there is no hope. endlessly pushing the stone up the hill to see it roll back again said Sysiphus. what you see is all you can expect. There I stand.

The Plainsman said...

No hope, CFHead.

Il pesce puzza dalla testa.

Anonymous said...

Cowboys: As long as the second generation Jones's are around (Stephen, Jerry Jr., Charlotte), nothing will change. Even then, who knows what lurks in the mind of Spalding and the rest of the younger clan(?). So any expectation of change, real and sustained change, is pure daydream material. Does that mean another temporary Parcells kind of hire might be coming down the pike? Maybe. Probably. Look for a Gruden or somesuch type. But like Parcells, that'll only last for a short while. Jerry and his immediate family associates can't stand not being the official mouthpiece/center of attention. Like it was with Parcells, once he can no longer stand standing in the wings, he'll ruin the relationship. He can't help himself. Now that he's getting up there in years, when he does make that hire, the ruination will come that much sooner.

THL: I fluctuate from being meh about it, to falling back in love with it, to thinking it's run its course. I find some of what many have said about it to be dead on. Corby is a lightening rod and can be absolutely unlistenable at times, but he can also put out some quality broadcasting. Does the good outweigh the bad? Overall I'd say no. It's true. Whether he thinks he is or not, Mike has been coasting for years. It's getting worse. There's something almost odd about a 60 something guy who seems obsessed with bands and tv shows like a high school or college kid. It appears like it's the only thing other than a sports book here and there that he's interested in. Sorry, at that age it's strange and I'll leave my comment at that. Regardless, Mike seems to be riding out the contract. I wonder if after the 20th anniversary if not too long thereafter we begin to hear rumblings of impending announcements? Danny I like. But as I said earlier there is something to some of what a few of you are saying. He has become a bit full of himself over the past year or 2. His attitude today towards music was glaringly elitist. Actually it was glaringly immature. Maybe that's the rub with the whole show? There's no growth. If anything the hosts are regressing. With the Musers you see 3 guys getting older, wiser, more accepting in some ways, less open to things they once would've been more libertarian about, and just plain more reflective. It's almost like THL in trying so hard to be edgy and WFO, have become caricatures of themselves.

blergoyen said...

Don't you complainers realize you should be happy with a cold grilled-cheese sandwich because in most other cities all they get are mayonnaise sandwiches???

Anonymous said...

Ahem. Let me channel my inner Qualifying Norm (aka Norm who wants to make sure he can still get person a, b, or c on as future guest). . . . . . . Uh, and I mean absolutely no offense here. This is no criticism of you whatsoever. . . . . That sort of statement is meaningless. So what if we have it good here? We're here, not, oh, St. Louis. If that's your way of thinking about things, then I sure hope you haven't any complaints about America, period. Because have you looked around the world? Have you actually been around the world, not just Western Europe? Let me tell you, it ain't that bad here.

Interesting thought on THL and their lack of growth.

Flipped on 103.3 today. Elf and Friedo have a show. Nice to hear Elf on the airwaves again. Like B&S and Greggo, he's now done the trifecta. Except in a way, working for 103.3 is sort of a return back to The Ticket. On that note, by the way, the cross over between the two stations is already underway. Programs on both frequencies are beginning to cross reference/mention the other. In a friendly manner, too boot. While listening to Elf and Friedo (sorry, Dick Hicks, I know it's the last Race Week of the year, but I can't deal with it), I started to think how 103.3 might be about to embark upon cracking the code that is The Ticket. How? By taking the IDEA of The Ticket and making it their own. Instead of, like certain ESPN programs in the past (looking right at you, B&S) and well, every single FAN show, copping Ticket lingo, segments, and just about everything - basically aping The Ticket to a T with zero success - they've decided to take the "guys just being guys who happen to know about and have inside info on, sports" concept and run with it. But do so by actually being themselves, and not trying to be THL of The FAN or whatever. It's early in the game, but so far they have my attention. Pman's too, for that matter. I'm looking forward to the ratings books over the next six or so months to see how this shakes out.

runitandrunitandrunitandrunitandrunit said...

Exactly right, 2:25. What's going on at ESPn is kind of what went on during the first years of The Ticket. They're getting for the most part locally known talent who've been around the media scene for a long time who 'get' the DFW area mentality and who have lived here and know the area intimately. The demo for sports talk radio is not going down. It's still the same as it's always been: mostly approaching, in the midst of, or about to exit middle age/d white dudes. The young aren't listening, and the scant numbers that are diminish with each year. No getting around it. There is no longer a HP High Ticket Group like the one Matt Stafford helmed (yeah, that Matt Stafford). If you've ever been to a remote or a bigger event, you see their demo first hand. All of this means that on the whole (please note that part, "on the whole" which means of course there are exceptions) the majority of the listening audience wants to "converse" with guys like them. Not snarky younger guys who come off as knowing everything (whether they do or not is not the question), are into music that is for the most part alien to them, and who are experiencing and relating their adventures that most listeners went through themselves years, decades ago. They want the guy next door who gives the knowing nod, not Jake, not TC, not Sean, not Machine, or whomever. It's not a knock on the guys I just mentioned, at all. It's just the way people are and how they relate to others and to whom they relate to. LIke seeks like. Unlike might be interesting for a bit, but in the long run it isn't.

Thus the picture here is that with a demo that ever remains the same and yet will inevitably shrink, and an up and coming demo that really doesn't exist, and the little that does keeps dropping off, you've got yourself a shaky future for The Ticket because they have no veteran replacements. Due to the probable future of the industry a youth movement is actually counterproductive. Cheaper, yes. So the upshot is that over the next years don't be surprised if a group of vets who've passed their 20 year mark begin to set sail, a group of (absolutely deserving) up and comers take their places, and the once mighty Ticket begins to slip in a most major way. Falling prey to its sibling with big mouse ears and a largely aging talent pool that connect with a largely aging demo.

The Plainsman said...

225, I had exactly the same thought listening to Mosely and Cowlishaw. This is what people want -- guys talking to each other with some expertise and genuine warmth, not endless bits and everyone-talking-at-the-same-time game-show segs and hollering over each other like . . . wait, that's another post.

runit, I have to take issue with part of your post. I think The Ticket is doing the right thing to develop successor talent. Shake Joint, Cirque, younger version of the kind of camaraderie, fun, and thoughtfulness that have cemented the weekday shows on our radio dials. I'd listen to either one of those shows regularly.

The fun of this for us reckless speculators, of course, is what (for example) The Hardline thinks of Cumulus counterprogramming with a show that most observers on this site seem to think is quite good. Doubt we will see a ratings revolution anytime soon, but let's keep an eye down the road two or three books from now.

runitandrunitandrunitandrunitandrunit said...

Criticism taken. But I think you and probably a lot of commenters and regular readers are the exact exceptions to the rule I'm talking about. The demos don't lie. They've been the same since the station began and for the most part have remained the same and even aged. DA has pointed this out time and again. You can't get around it. I know I'm going to get all sorts of rebuttals claiming how they love The Shake Joint and CdS and yadda yadda yadda. That's great. I believe it. But again, the younger listener is an outlier. Same goes with the demo listener who would tune in on a daily basis to hear Jake, Sean, and the rest of the JV crew. And again, that's not to disparage either the outliers or the younger hosts. It's just that the reality of human nature is like likes like. At the end of the day the vast majority of 40-50 something white dudes want to hear, on a daily basis year in and year out, someone who speaks their language, who has gone through what they have, who is going through the same things they are now.

runitandrunitandrunitandrunitandrunit said...

To add on. The intuitive thing is to think that "yeah, The Ticket is smart for bringing these kids up the way they are." But don't discount the fiscal, i.e., cheapness, factor either. Regardless, it is what you'd intuitively think is the right and smart move. But it's not. To reiterate from my other two comments, the demos for sports (and all) talk radio, am or fm, are in no way getting younger. Just the opposite. You have to air what translates to your core audience. I can guarantee you that your average middle aged guy will absolutely, sooner rather than later, be turned off by The Shake Joint if exposed to it on a daily basis for an extended period of time. It has zero to do with chops of TSJ fellas. It has to do with being relatable for the long haul. And that's EXACTLY how The Ticket and THL in particular so quickly became what they did: they immediately related to their audience in every way. Their audience of middle aged white dudes who are hanging on to what's left and loving the fact that they have some buddies who are speaking their language, who are also helping them get through the work week.

Anonymous said...

As someone who is probably in the younger end of the demographic (too old to start a high school fan club but around the age of the up and comer JVers), I am amazed that we are listening to the same shows. I love the Musers but The Hardline is my show of choice.

I started listening right around when Greggo left. Thanks to our pals at the Unticket, I've gone back and listened to the old shows and I probably wouldn't have been into the show that much back then. Greggo just isn't my thing. And maybe it's coming to the station towards the end of things with him and just not being there Day 1 but he leaves me with a big old meh when I listen to archived Hardline shows.

Corby can be too sheltered/pompous/privileged. I like Mike's music and TV segments and hearing old band stories. But I really like the weekend guys a lot and think they're finding their niche. Shake Joint and Cirque are solid and most people I know in my age group that listen agree. Again, love the Musers too but that didn't seem to be a point of argument here.

Anonymous said...

Run it, I'm not sure I get your point. Something about radio demographics getting younger? Perhaps you should write a few more (preferably longer) posts making the exact same point?

runitandrunitandrunitandrunitandrunit said...

That's all you got, 1:37? Next time get your drink on a bit more before you late night snark. Heck, you couldn't even get your own point right. Or maybe you just don't read too well. It's OK, friend. Remember, Reading Is Fundamental. You'll get through this. Promise.

Anonymous said...

If you think Elf or anything on ESPN is good then you've got major problems or you're just really old.

If you're into jewish phrases and unintelligent sports talk with no solutions, he might be the guy for you.

Anonymous said...

Hahaha. "Just really old." That's truly funny. Only someone really young----chronologically, emotionally, or mentally would make such a statement. Still, it's funny.

Anonymous said...


I don't think I've ever read such an on point summation of how The Ticket got to where it is. At first I was with Pman. I thought you were being a bit too narrow. After re reading your comments, I have to say that I'm right there with you man. Well put brutha. I'm a true blue D1P1 and I can attest to what you're saying. That's exactly how it took off so quickly and only got bigger. It's what keeps me and almost everyone I know coming back year in and year out for almost 20 years now. Honestly speaking here. The day I can no longer relate. Really relate. LIke I always have since D!. That's when it'll no longer be my Ticket. That's when it'll be time to move on down the dial or find another set of friends to like you said get through the work week. I guess this makes me also really old.

runitandrunitandrunitandrunitandrunit said...

"jewish phrases." I think it's pretty easy to see where you're coming from. It isn't a pretty place. If by enjoying something that someone the likes of you deems to mean that I have "major problems," then I am, proudly, "majorly plagued by problems."

It's a shame that the education system so woefully failed you; or perhaps you failed it (?). Either way, it is sad.

slinky said...

I come on here after a while and see all THL nut kicking. I'm listening more to THL these days now that Galloway is gone and KLUV is beating us down with Christmas music. I pretty much tune out anything Corby related like Detainment news and Quick Whips. Boring stuff...really boring!

slinky said...

...oh yeah, I'm looking at the DMN the otherday, and see they have Corby as one of the pickers for the football games. LOLOL!! Sure enough, there was his stupid lookin Alfred E Newman smiling face!